RKMBs Forums .::Important::. Politics and Current Events Hurricane Katrina

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r3x29yz4a said:

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wannabuyamonkey said:

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the G-man said:
I don't think anyone here is particularly incensed at the looters stealing food to survive. It's the ones stealing TVs, etc., we find repugnant.

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Of course there's even a problem with those looting to "survive" recently I heard that the government has essentially taken over the grocery stores and is distributing the food w/in, ut the looters have been taking the food and hording it. So while it's a survival instict. It's survival at the expence of others.

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agreed. unfortunately these situations cause a panic to set in where people will hoard whatever they can get.
hopefully they can clamp down on the food looting and fairly distribute it.

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one of the city’s most important legends, Antoine "Fats" Domino, has not been heard from since Monday afternoon. Domino’s rollicking boogie-woogie piano and deep soul voice are not only part of the Rock 'n' Roll Hall of Fame but responsible for dozens of hits like “Blue Monday,” “Ain’t That a Shame,” “Blueberry Hill” and “I’m Walking (Yes, Indeed, I’m Talking).”

Domino, 76, lives with his wife Rosemary and daughter in a three-story pink-roofed house in New Orleans’ 9th ward, which is now under water.

On Monday afternoon, Domino told his manager, Al Embry of Nashville, that he would “ride out the storm” at home. Embry is now frantic.

Calls have been made to Louisiana Gov. Kathleen Blanco’s office and to various police officials, and though there’s lots of sympathetic response, the whereabouts of Domino and his family remain a mystery.

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theory9 said:
people concerned with solving problems tend to be apolitical and are often the people who really get things done.

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the G-man said:
More bad news out of News Orleans. Fox News is reporting that blues legend and rock and roll pioneer "Fats" Domino has been missing since the Hurricane:

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Methos said:
I just can't believe that a major city like New Orleans pretty much no longer exists (as we know it.) I am literally unable to wrap my mind around that, despite the news images and photos.

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the G-man said:

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Methos said:
I just can't believe that a major city like New Orleans pretty much no longer exists (as we know it.) I am literally unable to wrap my mind around that, despite the news images and photos.

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Yeah, it's weird.

My wife travels/traveled there annually for a conference. And just tonight, I reached into the cupboard for a coffee mug and the first one I pulled out was one she brought back from legendary N.O. coffee shop Cafe DuMonde.

I very carefully put it back, realizing that we will in all likelihood never have the opportunity to get another.

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Captain Sammitch said:
I just don't have any words to describe the devastation that's taking place over there.

I side with Gob here. Fuck politics. Time and a place. This is neither.

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Captain Sammitch said:
Now, now, G-Man, you don't want to infringe upon their rights, do you?

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unrestrained id said:

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Captain Sammitch said:
I just don't have any words to describe the devastation that's taking place over there.

I side with Gob here. Fuck politics. Time and a place. This is neither.

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Captain Sammitch said:
Now, now, G-Man, you don't want to infringe upon their rights, do you?

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Rob Kamphausen said:
politics? are you fucking kidding me?

fuck you.

not the time.

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Poverty Lad said:
No, Rob, Fuck YOU.

If anything in UID's post preceding is true, then this disaster is squarely laid at Bush's feet. People died, are dying, because of his blundering badly with the issues at hand.

Not the time? You're right, the time was several years ago. But now all we can do is shake our heads and help the survivors as best we can.

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"I don't think anybody anticipated the breach of the levees." - President Bush, September 1, 2005


I couldn't have said it better myself Poverty Lad.

I'm wondering when those times for politics finally roll around. With Iraq, another debacle that was predicted and the advice unheeded, we're now being told by the people Robbie agrees with here on these boards that the time for pointing fingers is over and pointless. With 9/11 as the Salon story points out, FEMA was another agency that warned that terror in New York as well as a hurricane in New Orleans was one of the TOP 3 MOST LIKELY disasters on the U.S.

This (or "these" rather) was/were not a situation(s) that couldn't have been predicted. It was predicted and was IGNORED.

It's predictable that you don't want your hero Bush to face any accountability but his fuck up's are mounting and people are dying again on U.S. soil on account of his fuck up's. Can it be you don't want these quyestions to be asked because it goes to the heart of the issue. These deaths can be laid at Bush's doorstep. And thus his policies, drained resources funneling towards Iraq, and those who support him making all these disastrous descisions are also at fault here?

And I think that "FUCK YOU" was directed squarely at me. You might want to curse:

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Reuters:Bush administration funding cuts forced federal engineers to delay improvements on the levees, floodgates and pumping stations that failed to protect New Orleans from Hurricane Katrina's floodwaters, agency documents showed on Thursday.

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Editorial
NYTimes.com

Waiting for a Leader

Published: September 1, 2005

George W. Bush gave one of the worst speeches of his life yesterday, especially given the level of national distress and the need for words of consolation and wisdom. In what seems to be a ritual in this administration, the president appeared a day later than he was needed. He then read an address of a quality more appropriate for an Arbor Day celebration: a long laundry list of pounds of ice, generators and blankets delivered to the stricken Gulf Coast. He advised the public that anybody who wanted to help should send cash, grinned, and promised that everything would work out in the end.

We will, of course, endure, and the city of New Orleans must come back. But looking at the pictures on television yesterday of a place abandoned to the forces of flood, fire and looting, it was hard not to wonder exactly how that is going to come to pass. Right now, hundreds of thousands of American refugees need our national concern and care. Thousands of people still need to be rescued from imminent peril. Public health threats must be controlled in New Orleans and throughout southern Mississippi. Drivers must be given confidence that gasoline will be available, and profiteering must be brought under control at a moment when television has been showing long lines at some pumps and spot prices approaching $4 a gallon have been reported.

Sacrifices may be necessary to make sure that all these things happen in an orderly, efficient way. But this administration has never been one to counsel sacrifice. And nothing about the president's demeanor yesterday - which seemed casual to the point of carelessness - suggested that he understood the depth of the current crisis.

While our attention must now be on the Gulf Coast's most immediate needs, the nation will soon ask why New Orleans's levees remained so inadequate. Publications from the local newspaper to National Geographic have fulminated about the bad state of flood protection in this beloved city, which is below sea level. Why were developers permitted to destroy wetlands and barrier islands that could have held back the hurricane's surge? Why was Congress, before it wandered off to vacation, engaged in slashing the budget for correcting some of the gaping holes in the area's flood protection?

It would be some comfort to think that, as Mr. Bush cheerily announced, America "will be a stronger place" for enduring this crisis. Complacency will no longer suffice, especially if experts are right in warning that global warming may increase the intensity of future hurricanes. But since this administration won't acknowledge that global warming exists, the chances of leadership seem minimal.

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A man covers the body of a man who died Thursday outside the Convention Center in New Orleans

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"I don't think anybody anticipated the breach of the levees." - President Bush, September 1, 2005

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It was a broiling August afternoon in New Orleans, Louisiana, the Big Easy, the City That Care Forgot. Those who ventured outside moved as if they were swimming in tupelo honey. Those inside paid silent homage to the man who invented air-conditioning as they watched TV "storm teams" warn of a hurricane in the Gulf of Mexico. Nothing surprising there: Hurricanes in August are as much a part of life in this town as hangovers on Ash Wednesday.

But the next day the storm gathered steam and drew a bead on the city. As the whirling maelstrom approached the coast, more than a million people evacuated to higher ground. Some 200,000 remained, however--the car-less, the homeless, the aged and infirm, and those die-hard New Orleanians who look for any excuse to throw a party.

The storm hit Breton Sound with the fury of a nuclear warhead, pushing a deadly storm surge into Lake Pontchartrain. The water crept to the top of the massive berm that holds back the lake and then spilled over. Nearly 80 percent of New Orleans lies below sea level--more than eight feet below in places--so the water poured in. A liquid brown wall washed over the brick ranch homes of Gentilly, over the clapboard houses of the Ninth Ward, over the white-columned porches of the Garden District, until it raced through the bars and strip joints on Bourbon Street like the pale rider of the Apocalypse. As it reached 25 feet (eight meters) over parts of the city, people climbed onto roofs to escape it.

Thousands drowned in the murky brew that was soon contaminated by sewage and industrial waste. Thousands more who survived the flood later perished from dehydration and disease as they waited to be rescued. It took two months to pump the city dry, and by then the Big Easy was buried under a blanket of putrid sediment, a million people were homeless, and 50,000 were dead. It was the worst natural disaster in the history of the United States.

When did this calamity happen? It hasn't--yet. But the doomsday scenario is not far-fetched. The Federal Emergency Management Agency lists a hurricane strike on New Orleans as one of the most dire threats to the nation, up there with a large earthquake in California or a terrorist attack on New York City.

- National Geographic, October, 2004

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Nadler plans bankruptcy bill in Katrina's wake
by Erik Engquist
Four Democratic members of Congress including Rep. Jerrold Nadler, D-Manhattan, plan to introduce a bill that would make it easier for victims of Hurricane Katrina to declare bankruptcy.

A bankruptcy reform law that passed earlier this year and takes effect on October 17 imposes new hurdles for people seeking to escape their debts through bankruptcy. Democrats had offered an amendment carving out an exception for victims of natural disaster, but it was defeated on a party-line vote.

The bill’s sponsors believe the measure has a better chance in Katrina’s wake.

“We are concerned that just as survivors of Hurricane Katrina are beginning to rebuild their lives, the new bankruptcy law will result in a further and unintended financial whammy,” Nadler and his colleagues said in a statement. “The new law is likely to have the consequence of preventing devastated families from being able to obtain relief from massive and unexpected new financial obligations they are incurring and by forcing them to repay their debt with income they no longer have, but which is counted by the law.”

The other sponsors are Reps. John Conyers, Jr., D-Mich., Mel Watt, D-N.C., and Sheila Jackson Lee, D-Texas. They plan to introduce the bill on Tuesday.

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New bankruptcy law a problem for Katrina victims

By Jonathan Stempel

NEW YORK, Sept 1 (Reuters) - Hurricane Katrina is expected to cause a spurt of bankruptcy filings by storm victims -- and sweeping changes in U.S. bankruptcy laws may leave them even more strapped than they otherwise might be.

The Bankruptcy Abuse Prevention and Consumer Protection Act, which takes effect Oct. 17, includes a slew of rules and restrictions intended to curb abuse. These are expected to make it harder for individuals to file to keep creditors away, and more difficult for businesses to reorganize.

But the law wasn't directed at people who file because of catastrophes such as Katrina, in which people lost homes, businesses and perhaps months of regular paychecks. Katrina has caused widespread devastation in Louisiana and Mississippi and left New Orleans, population 462,269, virtually uninhabitable.

"People who are seriously affected by this hurricane are not going to be able to file bankruptcy by October 17," said Henry Sommer, co-editor of "Collier on Bankruptcy," a leading reference work. "They have more pressing things in their lives, like survival."

Michigan's John Conyers, the ranking Democrat on the U.S. House of Representatives' Judiciary Committee, and three other House members pledged to soon introduce legislation to provide flexibility for victims of natural disasters in bankruptcy.

Conyers' aides said legislation may be introduced next week, but aides to House Republicans said the law doesn't need amending because it only cracks down on abuse. Aides to Sen. Russ Feingold, a Wisconsin Democrat, said he might try to postpone the Oct. 17 implementation date.

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Koppel {on the number of people at the convention center -- the mayor says 15000 to 25,000 and FEMA says 5000): One of you is wrong. It's either 5000 or 15,000. Do you know?

Brown of FEMA: blah blah blah. 25,000.... We just learned of the convention center -- we being the federal government -- today.

Koppel: I've heard you say during the course of a number of interviews that you found out about the convention center today. Don't you guys watch television? Don't you guys listen to the radio? Our reporters have been reporting on it for more than just today.

Brown of FEMA: We learned about it FACTUALLY today that that's what existed.

Koppel: Here we are essentially FIVE DAYS after the storm hit and you're talking about what's going to happen in the next couple of days.... You didn't make preparations for what was going to happen in the event that [a category four storm hit]. Why didn't you?

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"This is a national emergency. This is a national disgrace. FEMA has been here three days, yet there is no command and control. We can send massive amounts of aid to tsunami victims, but we can't bail out the city of New Orleans."

- Terry Ebbert, New Orleans Homeland Security Director

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COOPER: Joining me from Baton Rouge is Louisiana Senator Mary Landrieu. Senator, appreciate you joining us tonight. Does the federal government bear responsibility for what is happening now? Should they apologize for what is happening now?

SEN. MARY LANDRIEU (D), LOUISIANA: Anderson, there will be plenty of time to discuss all of those issues, about why, and how, and what, and if. But, Anderson, as you understand, and all of the producers and directors of CNN, and the news networks, this situation is very serious and it's going to demand all of our full attention through the hours, through the nights, through the days.

Let me just say a few things. Thank President Clinton and former President Bush for their strong statements of support and comfort today. I thank all the leaders that are coming to Louisiana, and Mississippi, and Alabama to our help and rescue.

We are grateful for the military assets that are being brought to bear. I want to thank Senator Frist and Senator Reid for their extraordinary efforts.

Anderson, tonight, I don't know if you've heard -- maybe you all have announced it -- but Congress is going to an unprecedented session to pass a $10 billion supplemental bill tonight to keep FEMA and the Red Cross up and operating.

COOPER: Excuse me, Senator, I'm sorry for interrupting. I haven't heard that, because, for the last four days, I've been seeing dead bodies in the streets here in Mississippi. And to listen to politicians thanking each other and complimenting each other, you know, I got to tell you, there are a lot of people here who are very upset, and very angry, and very frustrated.

And when they hear politicians slap -- you know, thanking one another, it just, you know, it kind of cuts them the wrong way right now, because literally there was a body on the streets of this town yesterday being eaten by rats because this woman had been laying in the street for 48 hours. And there's not enough facilities to take her up.

Do you get the anger that is out here?

LANDRIEU: Anderson, I have the anger inside of me. Most of the homes in my family have been destroyed. Our homes have been destroyed. I understand what you're saying, and I know all of those details. And the president of the United States knows those details.

COOPER: Well, who are you angry at?

LANDRIEU: I'm not angry at anyone. I'm just expressing that it is so important for everyone in this nation to pull together, for all military assets and all assets to be brought to bare in this situation.

And I have every confidence that this country is as great and as strong as we can be do to that. And that effort is under way.

COOPER: Well, I mean, there are a lot of people here who are kind of ashamed of what is happening in this country right now, what is -- ashamed of what is happening in your state, certainly.

And that's not to blame the people who are there. It's a desperate situation. But I guess, you know, who can -- I mean, no one seems to be taking responsibility.

I mean, I know you say there's a time and a place for, kind of, you know, looking back, but this seems to be the time and the place. I mean, there are people who want answers, and there are people who want someone to stand up and say, "You know what? We should have done more. Are all the assets being brought to bare?"

LANDRIEU: Anderson, Anderson...

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unrestrained id said:
I'm wondering when those times for politics finally roll around.

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unrestrained id said:
It's predictable that you don't want your hero Bush to face ...

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Great Web Article said:
help out

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unrestrained id said:
You mean pressing for REAL answers should be frowned upon?...Especially when there's still time to help others?

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Answers?!? You can't lend a hand if you're pointing fingers all the time! Don't act like you give a damn about this. You probably started hunting for some scrap of quasi-journalism that let you pin the blame on dubya as soon as the weatherman said Katrina was coming back. And you probably just about creamed your pants when you found it.

I have no interest in defending the President. I have quite a bit of interest in you shutting the fuck up so people who actually care about this disaster can discuss it in a civilized manner.

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MisterJLA said:
That's the thing: who knows if added preparation and funds really could have made a difference?

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the G-man said:
Relief workers confront 'urban warfare'

I seriously think that anyone who fucks with or interferes with a relief worker should be shot on sight and their corpse hung from the nearest street light.

Bastards.

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Prometheus said:
I've just spent the last four days surviving on puddle water through a coffee filter, and anything my stomach could safely digest. 108 degree days, and sweat-covered, mosquito-ridden nights of the darkest night you've never seen. My apartment was ripped to shreds. It took me three days to get to family in South Carolina.

I hate George Bush. I think he's the anti-christ. But, right now, I could give a fuck. We need to get the UN and foreign aid for this. It's devastation. And sitting on a message board debating who's at fault is simply pointless.

Let's get some relief down there first. Then we can mercilessly beat whoever's fault it is....

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unrestrained id said:
Someone needs to send in the U.N.

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theory9 said:Now the snipers from the other CNN article deserve some of your sensible, Southern brand of justice!

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Also, G-Man, what difference is LA's law make martial law not legally recognized?

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