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Economics isn't his thing? What economic legislation has Obama sponsored? What legislation that he sponsored worked? Don;t believe the $600 million in ads MEM.

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btw I'd rather have a pet rock for President than Abdullah Obama....

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 Originally Posted By: britneyspearsatemyshorts
Economics isn't his thing? What economic legislation has Obama sponsored? What legislation that he sponsored worked? Don;t believe the $600 million in ads MEM.


Obama's plan makes sense to me. It's more of a return the way the taxes were when Clinton was in office. If Bush's economic policies paid off like Clinton's I would have no problem voting for McCain. They didn't.


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I hate to burst your bubble but we are in a different world than when Clinton was in office. Obama's tax plan(not economic plan as you refer to it), will not work because of the trillions in new spending he has proposed. Clinton actually restrained spending somewhat, so Obama is not proposing the same budget that Clinton did.

But back to the original discussion about economics, what economic legislation has Obama sponsored, and of those which have worked?

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Btw if you need time to watch Countdown and hope they give you some spin, come back later.

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Yes we are certainly in a different world after 8 yrs of Bush Jr. & I heard the same cries of doom when Clinton ran. The second time around it rings a bit hollow.


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The economy wasn't in bad shape when Clinton took over. Clinton didn't propose trillions in new spending. You may return to your Obama ads though if you like.

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It had been in bad shape until Bush Sr. raised taxes. Really why should normal Americans listen to the same old angry rants that we've heard before whenever it looks like a democrat is going to win?


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I forget how powerful advertising is sometimes.

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God bless America!

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 Originally Posted By: Matter-eater Man
Yes we are certainly in a different world after 8 yrs of Bush Jr. & I heard the same cries of doom when Clinton ran. The second time around it rings a bit hollow.
If Obama was going to just roll back the taxes on the individuals we would survive....it would hurt the economy but we would survive. But Obama is going to go after small businesses and corporations like never beofre and cripple the economy and the world. He is nothing like Clinton.

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 Originally Posted By: PJP
 Originally Posted By: Matter-eater Man
Yes we are certainly in a different world after 8 yrs of Bush Jr. & I heard the same cries of doom when Clinton ran. The second time around it rings a bit hollow.
If Obama was going to just roll back the taxes on the individuals we would survive....it would hurt the economy but we would survive. But Obama is going to go after small businesses and corporations like never beofre and cripple the economy and the world. He is nothing like Clinton.


I think your wrong but reguardless we do know the republican style of economic policies don't work & all the things your scared of happening are already happening.


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 Originally Posted By: Matter-eater Man
 Originally Posted By: PJP
 Originally Posted By: Matter-eater Man
Yes we are certainly in a different world after 8 yrs of Bush Jr. & I heard the same cries of doom when Clinton ran. The second time around it rings a bit hollow.
If Obama was going to just roll back the taxes on the individuals we would survive....it would hurt the economy but we would survive. But Obama is going to go after small businesses and corporations like never beofre and cripple the economy and the world. He is nothing like Clinton.


I think your wrong but reguardless we do know the republican style of economic policies don't work & all the things your scared of happening are already happening.


BINGO!

It's kind of hard to predict doom and gloom if you change which party is in the White House when we already have doom and gloom with the party currently in the White House. \:lol\:

Same thing with "socialism". Kind of hard to make your case when your own President nationalized the banks and is redistributing public wealth in unprecedented amounts.. \:lol\:

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I don't find anything that is happening funny right now whomod. MEM and I sometimes do try to talk civily about issues and what we think. Please try it sometime. If Obama wins I will wish him all the luck in the world. I love my country and want the best for it.

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 Originally Posted By: PJP
I don't find anything that is happening funny right now whomod. MEM and I sometimes do try to talk civily about issues and what we think. Please try it sometime. If Obama wins I will wish him all the luck in the world. I love my country and want the best for it.


It's kind of hard to take the high road when most of the time you guys don't.

And you're right. there is nothing funny about the current situation, but that's Ok, hope is just around the corner. And that brings a growing amount of people, comfort and reassurance that things will start to change for the better soon.

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 Originally Posted By: Matter-eater Man
 Originally Posted By: PJP
 Originally Posted By: Matter-eater Man
Yes we are certainly in a different world after 8 yrs of Bush Jr. & I heard the same cries of doom when Clinton ran. The second time around it rings a bit hollow.
If Obama was going to just roll back the taxes on the individuals we would survive....it would hurt the economy but we would survive. But Obama is going to go after small businesses and corporations like never beofre and cripple the economy and the world. He is nothing like Clinton.


I think your wrong but reguardless we do know the republican style of economic policies don't work & all the things your scared of happening are already happening.
So please remember this.....You may save anywhere from 500 to 1000 dollars with Obama's tax plan every year when his his checks are mailed in January. Just watch what your living expenses are too though if he does what he says he will to the corporation and small business owners like myself. I am a small business owner but he doesn't thinks so. We employ over 40 people full and part time. We will have to cut jobs and raise prices just to survive and I know I am not alone......so think of good old PJP when you are paying more for your groceries, gas, clothes and when you go out to eat.


I have no love for Corporate CEOs making hundreds of millions and I want something to be done about that too. The shareholders should be doing more to stop the ceos from getting big payouts if the company is doing shitty. I just think we need to meet in the middle.

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 Originally Posted By: whomod
 Originally Posted By: PJP
I don't find anything that is happening funny right now whomod. MEM and I sometimes do try to talk civily about issues and what we think. Please try it sometime. If Obama wins I will wish him all the luck in the world. I love my country and want the best for it.


It's kind of hard to take the high road when most of the time you guys don't.

And you're right. there is nothing funny about the current situation, but that's Ok, hope is just around the corner. And that brings a growing amount of people, comfort and reassurance that things will start to change for the better soon.
I hope so too for all of us.

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PJP, have you ever heard the phrase "sticky prices"?

It's why your pack of gum is still $1.29 as opposed to the $1.19 it used to cost last year even though the high oil prices that caused it to rise in price to begin with, have already gone down.

And that to me is just plain opportunism and greed. An that is happening NOW, not under Obama, NOW. So i think it's unfair to blame any Obama policies for high prices. Sometimes prices go up because they have to but they never seem to go back down because they can.

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 Originally Posted By: PJP
...So please remember this.....You may save anywhere from 500 to 1000 dollars with Obama's tax plan every year when his his checks are mailed in January. Just watch what your living expenses are too though if he does what he says he will to the corporation and small business owners like myself. I am a small business owner but he doesn't thinks so. We employ over 40 people full and part time. We will have to cut jobs and raise prices just to survive and I know I am not alone......so think of good old PJP when you are paying more for your groceries, gas, clothes and when you go out to eat.

....


Believe it or not I'm also thinking of you. The next year or two is going to be crappy probably no who wins but I see Obama as the best chance of digging us all out. The boyfriend & I don't go out to eat like we used to in part because we're budgeting. That's a two income household with no kids. I can't imagine families with our incomes eating out more, that's bad for you.


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Huffington Post reports:

 Quote:
Now one of John McCain's actual advisers has switched sides:

Charles Fried, a professor at Harvard Law School, has long been one of the most important conservative thinkers in the United States. Under President Reagan, he served, with great distinction, as Solicitor General of the United States. Since then, he has been prominently associated with several Republican leaders and candidates, most recently John McCain, for whom he expressed his enthusiastic support in January.

This week, Fried announced that he has voted for Obama-Biden by absentee ballot. In his letter to Trevor Potter, the General Counsel to the McCain-Palin campaign, he asked that his name be removed from the several campaign-related committees on which he serves. In that letter, he said that chief among the reasons for his decision "is the choice of Sarah Palin at a time of deep national crisis."


Um... correct me if i'm wrong but when one of your own advisers votes for the other guy, that's not exactly a ringing vote of confidence. I guess I'm not the only one who thinks McCain is too old and finds the idea of a Palin presidency terrifying.

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huffington post


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 Originally Posted By: whomod
PJP, have you ever heard the phrase "sticky prices"?

It's why your pack of gum is still $1.29 as opposed to the $1.19 it used to cost last year even though the high oil prices that caused it to rise in price to begin with, have already gone down.

And that to me is just plain opportunism and greed. An that is happening NOW, not under Obama, NOW. So i think it's unfair to blame any Obama policies for high prices. Sometimes prices go up because they have to but they never seem to go back down because they can.
I know that. Obama can not be blamed fo any of this. Fine. So wait a year and a half if he wins and we will have this conversation again. I hopw we can all say I'm wrong and the country will be doing great!

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 Originally Posted By: rex
huffington post


Oh, i'm sorry you asshole, i forgot. If you don't like the source, it therefore never happened. Here:

The Boston Globe:
Charles Fried supports Obama

ABC News:

Reagan's Solicitor General/McCain Adviser Charles Fried Voted for Obama

Newsweek:
The Moderate Voice: Yet Another Republican for Obama: Charles Fried

Is that enough? I can go on.

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 Originally Posted By: whomod
 Originally Posted By: rex
huffington post


Oh, i'm sorry you asshole, i forgot. If you don't like the source, it therefore never happened. Here:



I'm an asshole because I don't believe links from blogs and message boards? You need to learn the difference between opinion and fact.


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 Originally Posted By: rex
Rex

Last edited by Matter-eater Man; 2008-10-26 6:27 PM.

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Funny, bsams posted all sorts of crap from blogs regarding Obama being an evil terrorist and I don't see you rushing in there to say jack.

At least my stuff always has, as you can clearly see, mainstream media concurring.

You act as if I posted Huffington post saying that McCain has devil horns protruding from his head or something.

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 Originally Posted By: rex
 Originally Posted By: whomod
 Originally Posted By: rex
huffington post


Oh, i'm sorry you asshole, i forgot. If you don't like the source, it therefore never happened. Here:



I'm an asshole because I don't believe links from blogs and message boards? You need to learn the difference between opinion and fact.


the difference is whether it was in the la times or the wall street journal, obviously.


go.

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 Originally Posted By: whomod
Funny, bsams posted all sorts of crap from blogs regarding Obama being an evil terrorist and I don't see you rushing in there to say jack.


That's because its more fun making you my bitch.

 Quote:
At least my stuff always has, as you can clearly see, mainstream media concurring.


failing left wing propaganda stations are not mainstream.

 Quote:
You act as if I posted Huffington post saying that McCain has devil horns protruding from his head or something.


No, I said you need to know the difference between fact and opinion.


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 Originally Posted By: Matter-eater Man
 Originally Posted By: rex
Rex


Yes, that's another forum here. You should branch out and try some of them. You might learn a thing or two.


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The gOP. Still in disarray. This is rom todays Washington post by Davi Frum who was a speech writer for George Bush and now works at the right wing American Enterprise Institute.

 Quote:
After months and months of wan enthusiasm among Republicans, these last weeks have at last energized the core of the party. But there's a downside: The very same campaign strategy that has belatedly mobilized the Republican core has alienated and offended the great national middle, which was the only place where the 2008 election could have been won.

I could pile up the poll numbers here, but frankly . . . it's too depressing. You have to go back to the Watergate era to see numbers quite so horrible for the GOP.

McCain's awful campaign is having awful consequences down the ballot. I spoke a little while ago to a senior Republican House member. "There is not a safe Republican seat in the country," he warned. "I don't mean that we're going to lose all of them. But we could lose any of them."

In the Senate, things look, if possible, even worse.

The themes and messages that are galvanizing the crowds for Palin are bleeding Sens. John Sununu in New Hampshire, Gordon Smith in Oregon, Norm Coleman in Minnesota and Susan Collins in Maine. The Palin approach might have been expected to work better in more traditionally conservative states such as Virginia, North Carolina and Georgia, but they have not worked well enough to compensate for the weak Republican economic message at a moment of global financial crisis. Result: the certain loss of John Warner's Senate seat in Virginia, the probable loss of Elizabeth Dole's in North Carolina, an unexpectedly tough fight for Saxby Chambliss's in Georgia -- and an apparent GOP surrender in Colorado, where it looks as if the National Republican Senatorial Committee has already pulled its ads from the air.


Disarray!!!!

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\:lol\:

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 Originally Posted By: rex
 Originally Posted By: Matter-eater Man
 Originally Posted By: rex
Rex


Yes, that's another forum here. You should branch out and try some of them. You might learn a thing or two.


Naw, I know you would like us to spend more time together but I think you bring enough of that forum here to the politics board that I don't even need to visit. Thanks for being interested in helping others learn


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 Originally Posted By: Matter-eater Man
 Originally Posted By: rex
 Originally Posted By: Matter-eater Man
 Originally Posted By: rex
Rex


Yes, that's another forum here. You should branch out and try some of them. You might learn a thing or two.


*buries head in sand*


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Here's McCain's top economic adviser giving some "straight talk" to CNNMoney.com:

 Quote:
Younger, healthier workers likely wouldn't abandon their company-sponsored plans, said Douglas Holtz-Eakin, McCain's senior economic policy adviser.

"Why would they leave?" said Holtz-Eakin. "What they are getting from their employer is way better than what they could get with the credit."


\:lol\: \:lol\:

It's over guys...

The Obama campaign was quick to jump on this moment of candor from the McCain team:

The Obama campaign:

 Quote:
“This morning, the McCain campaign’s top economic policy advisor unleashed an October Surprise of straight talk when he finally admitted that the health insurance people currently get from their employer is ‘way better’ than the health care they would get if John McCain becomes President. Independent studies have shown that under John McCain’s health care plan, at least 20 million Americans will lose the insurance they rely on and be forced to buy health care coverage on the individual market that costs more than $12,000 with a tax credit of just $5,000. Senator McCain has been trying to cover this up for months, but his advisor’s brutal honesty today is certainly better late than never, and it should give every American pause about electing a candidate who has proposed such radical and dangerous changes to our health care system,” said Obama-Biden Spokesman Bill Burton.


Obama is right, the question is not are you better off than you were 4 years ago. Everyone knows the answer to that. The question is will you be better off 4 years from now. Under McCain, you're fucked.

More reaction:

Time:

McCain Campaign Says Your Health Care Plan Is Better Than Theirs

Health Care for American Now (HCAN):

MCCAIN CAMPAIGN: OUR HEALTH PLAN DOESN'T WORK

\:lol\: \:lol\: \:lol\: \:lol\: \:lol\:

It's almost like McCain doesn't WANT to win.

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Glacier16 #1021362 2008-10-29 8:08 PM
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 Originally Posted By: Lucius Prometheus Vorenus
[...It's like when McCain swung from being centric to Rightwing-extreme...


What, exactly, has he done that's "Rightwing-extreme, Promod? Other than running against Obama, of course?

McCain gave the commencement address at Liberty University, making nice with "agent of intolerance" Jerry Falwell -- but also gave the exact same speech at the far-left New School for Social Research. That seems pretty moderate: reaching out to both the far left and far right and asking for tolerance from both.

But there was no major shift in either his policies or his rhetoric that accompanied his trip to Liberty. This is like saying that Obama turned into a right-wing Christianist by virtue of appearing at Rick Warren's Church, an argument no one would take seriously.

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Yeah Promod!

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