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It's an interesting but flawed essay. It's glaring flaw is the fact that the attitude she speaks of is found in younger voters BUT the vast majority of the electorate is still made up of old set in their ways fogeys.

 Quote:
Rosa Brooks:
Sex, race and Gen Y voters

Why younger citizens don't share the media's obsession over the electability of a woman or an African American.
January 10, 2008

Even the dimmest media bulbs have noticed that there's something a little different about this year's crop of Democratic presidential candidates. Hillary Clinton, who won the New Hampshire primary, appears to have an extra X chromosome. Meanwhile, Barack Obama, who won the Iowa caucuses, has been blessed with some extra melanin in his skin, which also makes him stand out from the usual crowd of middle-aged, white-guy candidate-clones.

The media just can't stop gushing and clucking and gasping about it all. Oh, my gosh, Hillary Clinton is female! Barack Obama is, uh, black! Will American voters accept a female candidate? A black candidate? Are voters more sexist or more racist? What's a bigger problem in America today, sexism or racism?

Snore.

These questions are tedious and inane. Simplistic efforts to evaluate whether racism or sexism is "worse" are inherently meaningless. Racism and sexism operate in complex and different ways. We should reflect on the ways in which racism and sexism have marred our history and cast shadows over our future, but let's not turn it into a parlor game about who's got it worse, women or blacks.

Increasingly, the media obsession with whether Americans will be less likely to vote for a black man or for a woman is also beside the point -- because to an emerging generation of younger voters, the very terms in which the questions have been framed no longer make much sense.

Start with race. In the context of the 2008 election, the question, "Would you vote for a black man for president?" takes for granted certain assumptions: that there is a clearly defined category we can label "black men," that Obama fits into that category and that belonging to that category matters.

For Americans over 40, these may seem like perfectly justified assumptions. Of course there's a category properly labeled "black men." Of course Obama fits into that category -- he's got that extra melanin, right? Which makes him black, which matters, because "black maleness" triggers a set of associations that affect how people think about him.

But increasingly, there's evidence that younger Americans just don't think about race in the same simplistic ways. They're more likely than older Americans to be minorities themselves, for one thing. In 2006, only 19.8% of Americans over 60 were minorities, compared with about 40% of Americans under the age of 40. And younger minorities come from a far wider range of racial and ethnic backgrounds than their older counterparts. Once, "minority" largely meant "black," which in turn meant "descendant of the Africans brought to the U.S. as slaves." Some of today's young minorities fit that profile, but others are descended from Filipino farmers, Chinese schoolteachers, Iranian engineers, Mexican construction workers, Congolese doctors or Haitian shopkeepers.

The tapestry gets even richer. The number of inter-marriages has gone up dramatically over the last few decades, and as a consequence, so has the number of multiracial young Americans, who -- like Obama -- are neither this nor that, but a bit of this and bit of that, with a healthy dollop of something else. And regardless of their own status, younger Americans are more likely than older Americans to have dated inter-racially, to have close friends of other races and to live in families with relatives from other racial and ethnic backgrounds.

As a result, race literally isn't a black-and-white issue for many younger Americans. Questions like "Would you vote for a black man?" just don't compute because they assume a reality that's ceasing to exist, in which the term "black" has a fixed meaning, in which Obama's rich heritage can be reduced to a single word.

Younger Americans tend to think differently about gender. Generation Y -- those born after 1977 -- is dramatically more accepting of nontraditional gender roles than older generations; a recent survey found, for example, that 63% "completely disagree" that women should "return to traditional roles" in society. These younger Americans are also far more comfortable with homosexuality, which makes them less likely to assume that women who behave in less "traditional" ways must "really" be lesbians -- and if they are, Gen Y-ers wonder, who cares?

Americans under 30 grew up in a world in which women are CEOs and secretaries of State, and in which women make up the majority of U.S. college students. And, as with race, most younger Americans can't see what the big deal is. Of course a woman can be president. Of course being tough -- or getting a little teary-eyed -- on the campaign trail doesn't make you more or less feminine, or more or less suited to power.

For younger voters, "Do you think a woman or a black man could be a good president?" is the wrong question. As women and men increasingly work side by side and share power, as the U.S. becomes a more complex, multiracial and multiethnic nation, younger voters may increasingly be asking themselves a very different question: Can a middle-aged white guy possibly be qualified to lead us into the future?


Still, it'll piss Wonder Boy off. ;\)

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Why would it piss me off?

I myself would have voted for Colin Powell, if he had chosen to run for office in 1992, 1996 or 2000.
I have a very favorable opinion of Clarence Thomas, J.C. Watts, Alan Keyes, Andrew Young and many other politically, academically and otherwise accomplished black Americans.

My only reservation with minorities, or liberals, or women pursuing careers, or white conservatives for that matter, is when they act in a way that is unpatriotic, and against the best interests of the United States.

So your remarks are quickly revealed to be yet another slander of yours, to paint me as a "racist in pursuit of a white-only America", that my many posts over more than 6 years here quickly reveals to be a false assertion.

Unlike your slanderous malevolence, which is plainly on display for all here.

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 Originally Posted By: Wonder Boy

it pissed me off.


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 Originally Posted By: rex
 Originally Posted By: Wonder Boy

it pissed me off.


The article's facts didn't piss me off, the deliberate slander by Whomod did.

My opinions are what I actually say, not what you "script" me to say.

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whomod Offline OP
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I'm glad we clarified that then.

So now you have no problem with women in nontraditional roles and with homosexuals?

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 Originally Posted By: Wonder Boy
 Originally Posted By: rex
 Originally Posted By: Wonder Boy

it pissed me off.


The article's facts didn't piss me off, the deliberate slander by Whomod did.

My opinions are what I actually say, not what you "script" me to say.


Since when did you care about facts?


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 Originally Posted By: whomod
It's an interesting but flawed essay. It's glaring flaw is the fact that the attitude she speaks of is found in younger voters BUT the vast majority of the electorate is still made up of old set in their ways fogeys.


How is that the article's 'glaring flaw' when that is the very point of the article? The part at the end that you made boldy-bold and stand-outty clearly states that the question of electing a black or woman president is becoming superficial specifically to young voters. It doesn't say that it's a trend across the board.


whomod said: I generally don't like it when people decide to play by the rules against people who don't play by the rules.
It tends to put you immediately at a disadvantage and IMO is a sign of true weakness.
This is true both in politics and on the internet."

Our Friendly Neighborhood Ray-man said: "no, the doctor's right. besides, he has seniority."
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 Originally Posted By: whomod
I'm glad we clarified that then.

So now you have no problem with women in nontraditional roles and with homosexuals?



I have a problem with women in non-traditional roles when they neglect their children to pursue their careers, and when they cease having children at replacement-population levels at all.

I read an article recently that millions of women in the last decade have started stay-at-home businesses, so they can have a career and still be around to raise and be with their children.

The two options for women (careers, and traditional motherhood) aren't necessarily mutually exclusive. But liberal feminism teaches a view that "housewife" and "stay-at-home mom", are pejoratives.
And even view "marriage" as slavery.

Liberalism, as envisioned by Gramsci and the Frankfurt School of marxists (from which 60's liberalism has directly sprung from) want nothing less than the abolishment of families, christianity, and democracy itself, to be replaced by a socialist ideology and state.
Liberals see their political views as a benign movement, but they don't see the end result that their marxist leaders envision. Liberal teachings of environmentalism and overpopulation, and material secularism, discourage having children.

As I've said many times, a human race, a civilization, that chooses not to reproduce and continue itself, is morally sick and on a path toward self-destruction.
Within 40 years, Western civilization will be overwhelmed by foreign immigration and cease to exist. In Europe, they will replace their democracy with an islamic government. In the U.S., it will be a welfare state overwhelmed with Mexicans and central Americans, that resembles the governments, corruption, high taxes and class extremes of Cental American and South Americans states.

This is the fruit of radical feminism and other allied liberal corruptions of the United States.



I like and socialize with gay people, as individual friends and co-workers. I took my girlfriend to a New Years Eve party, where a good percentage of the people there were gay, and I enjoyed talking to everyone there.

But the larger gay community, as a political movement, is part of the movement to strangle all reference to our national origins from Christianity, is part of the liberalism that encourages globalism, encourages excessive guilt over past racism that seeks to undermine will to be patriotic and defend our nation, that advocates removal of the Ten Commandments and all other Christian references from our government and schools, that advocates declaring private free practice of Christian teachings that homosexuality is immoral to be a "hate-crime" (as they already have in Canada), and that otherwise silences Christian political ability to advocate the issues important to them, as every other political group in the U.S. has the right to.
To do this, gay activists, in collaboration with other secularist liberals, abuse and misrepresent "separation of church and state" and utilize fear tactics to suppress Christian political representation, and our Christian heritage.

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 Originally Posted By: thedoctor
 Originally Posted By: whomod
It's an interesting but flawed essay. It's glaring flaw is the fact that the attitude she speaks of is found in younger voters BUT the vast majority of the electorate is still made up of old set in their ways fogeys.


How is that the article's 'glaring flaw' when that is the very point of the article? The part at the end that you made boldy-bold and stand-outty clearly states that the question of electing a black or woman president is becoming superficial specifically to young voters. It doesn't say that it's a trend across the board.


I guess I see it as a flaw because it paints a too hopeful note when Gen Y voters, although larger this time around, still aern't enough to make an overall difference IMO. It's a hopeful sign is all and if anything, it may sway some races ever so slightly, but it isn't some sweeping trendas you pointed out.

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 Originally Posted By: rex
 Originally Posted By: Wonder Boy
 Originally Posted By: rex
 Originally Posted By: Wonder Boy

it pissed me off.


The article's facts didn't piss me off, the deliberate slander by Whomod did.

My opinions are what I actually say, not what you "script" me to say.


Since when did you care about facts?


If you cared about the truth, you'd acknowledge I've stated the sourced facts across multiple topics.


But then why should I expect you to acknowledge the truth, when you're nothing but a...

..troll, trying to sling some mud.

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Ha! Trolls have funny hair!


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 Originally Posted By: whomod

I guess I see it as a flaw because it paints a too hopeful note when Gen Y voters, although larger this time around, still aern't enough to make an overall difference IMO. It's a hopeful sign is all and if anything, it may sway some races ever so slightly, but it isn't some sweeping trendas you pointed out.


If they're just partisan liberals who are voting for the same corporate lobby interests that dominate both parties, by buying into partisan propaganda that whites/Republicans are evil, even as their Democrat alternatives use-race-baiting, gender-baiting victim politics, and then represent the same corporate interests that export jobs, import cheap foreign labor, and push us toward open borders and an economic union with Mexico and Canada, how is that a "hopeful sign"?

You're gloating about a liberal victory, that is in truth a corporate victory, against U.S. sovereignty and economic stability.

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I agree with this article.


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 Originally Posted By: Wonder Boy


Why would it piss me off?

I myself would have voted for Colin Powell, if he had chosen to run for office in 1992, 1996 or 2000.
I have a very favorable opinion of Clarence Thomas, J.C. Watts, Andrew Young and many other politically, academically and otherwise accomplished black Americans.

My only reservation with minorities, or liberals, or women pursuing careers, or white conservatives for that matter, is when they act in a way that is unpatriotic, and against the best interests of the United States.

So your remarks are quickly revealed to be yet another slander of yours, to paint me as a "racist in pursuit of a white-only America", when my many posts over more than 6 years here quickly reveals to be false.

Unlike your slanderous malevolence, which is plainly on display for all here.

see, you're pissed off. whomod was right.


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 Originally Posted By: Wonder Boy


Why would it piss me off?

I myself would have voted for Colin Powell, if he had chosen to run for office in 1992, 1996 or 2000.
I have a very favorable opinion of Clarence Thomas, J.C. Watts, Andrew Young and many other politically, academically and otherwise accomplished black Americans.

My only reservation with minorities, or liberals, or women pursuing careers, or white conservatives for that matter, is when they act in a way that is unpatriotic, and against the best interests of the United States.

So your remarks are quickly revealed to be yet another slander of yours, to paint me as a "racist in pursuit of a white-only America", when my many posts over more than 6 years here quickly reveals to be false.

Unlike your slanderous malevolence, which is plainly on display for all here.


It's horrible when people do what they think is right as opposed to what's right for national intrest.

I shouldn't pick on you WB, your opinions suck, but at least you are sincere and sane.


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 Originally Posted By: rex
 Originally Posted By: Wonder Boy
 Originally Posted By: rex
 Originally Posted By: Wonder Boy

it pissed me off.


The article's facts didn't piss me off, the deliberate slander by Whomod did.

My opinions are what I actually say, not what you "script" me to say.


Since when did you care about facts?


That's hypocritical, considering how you sided with Pariah and his sophistry.


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 Originally Posted By: Halo82
 Originally Posted By: rex
 Originally Posted By: Wonder Boy
 Originally Posted By: rex
 Originally Posted By: Wonder Boy

it pissed me off.


The article's facts didn't piss me off, the deliberate slander by Whomod did.

My opinions are what I actually say, not what you "script" me to say.


Since when did you care about facts?


That's hypocritical, considering how you sided with Pariah and his sophistry.



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Personally to me race & gender don't matter. It's a cool side factor that I'm probably going to vote for somebody who isn't the traditional white male candidate though.


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 Originally Posted By: Wonder Boy


I have a problem with women in non-traditional roles when they neglect their children to pursue their careers, and when they cease having children at replacement-population levels at all.

so free will and how they choose to live their lives should come after some baby-making quota? you do realize the population has gone up 2 or 3 times in just the last 30 years.
And I ask you if this is really about having babies and not about keeping women subservient in the home, why don't you advocate stay at home fathers?

 Quote:


The two options for women (careers, and traditional motherhood) aren't necessarily mutually exclusive. But liberal feminism teaches a view that "housewife" and "stay-at-home mom", are pejoratives.
And even view "marriage" as slavery.

You act like it's some sort of secret conspiracy. It's just a different view in terms of what options are available in life. Women have only had the option to actually live a life of their own choosing for 30 or so years. Men have always had the right to do whatever they please, it smacks of insecurity to be so fearful of change.

 Quote:
Liberalism, as envisioned by Gramsci and the Frankfurt School of marxists (from which 60's liberalism has directly sprung from) want nothing less than the abolishment of families, christianity, and democracy itself, to be replaced by a socialist ideology and state.



 Quote:
Liberals see their political views as a benign movement, but they don't see the end result that their marxist leaders envision. Liberal teachings of environmentalism and overpopulation, and material secularism, discourage having children.

wow. you're so fucking crazy and so fucking wrong. Liberals want people to have freedom in their lives. Ultimately Liberalism is more towards the aim of free will, a gift from God (or Allah). One could argue that conservatives trying to impose their views and "morals" on to others violates the free will that God (or Allah) gave humanity.

And overpopulation is bad. Look at what happens when you cram too many people together. You get disease, you get pollution, you get poverty.

 Quote:
As I've said many times, a human race, a civilization, that chooses not to reproduce and continue itself, is morally sick and on a path toward self-destruction.

how many kids do you have?
 Quote:
Within 40 years, Western civilization will be overwhelmed by foreign immigration and cease to exist.

But we're all humans. Why does it matter where those demographics come from? Unless this is an issue of race for you, you should be more relaxed about the fact that humanity has gone up by the billions since 1950.
And if this is another Mexican thing, well Mexico is part of Western Civilization.

 Quote:
In Europe, they will replace their democracy with an islamic government. In the U.S., it will be a welfare state overwhelmed with Mexicans and central Americans, that resembles the governments, corruption, high taxes and class extremes of Cental American and South Americans states.

so basically this is a race war for you, right? more white people to stop the evil invaders?


 Quote:
This is the fruit of radical feminism and other allied liberal corruptions of the United States.

wow. I bet some girl with a Jimmy Carter button turned you down for a date once and you've just been burning with hatred ever since.

 Quote:
I like and socialize with gay people, as individual friends and co-workers. I took my girlfriend to a New Years Eve party, where a good percentage of the people there were gay, and I enjoyed talking to everyone there.

we're talking about gay people now?

 Quote:
But the larger gay community, as a political movement, is part of the movement to strangle all reference to our national origins from Christianity, is part of the liberalism that encourages globalism and guilt over past racism that seeks to undermine will to be patriotic and defend our nation, that advocates removal of the Ten Commandments and all other Christian references from our government and schools, advocates declaring private free practice of Christian teachings that homosexuality is immoral to be a "hate-crime" (as they already have in Canada), and otherwise silence Christian political ability to advocate the issues important to them, as every other political group in the U.S. has the right to. To do this, gay activists, in collaboration with other secularist liberals, abuse and misrepresent "separation of church and state" and utilize fear tactics to suppress Christian political representation, and our Christian heritage.

wow. you like gay people but you want it to be taught that they're sinners? somehow the gays are responsible for the removal of ten commandments, and not the fact that the constitution requires a church/state separation and as time goes on your little fairy tales belief become less and less important.
And no one is silencing christians. for god sakes you have the president as a hardcore "boner for jesus" type. Your message is out there, most people just don't take it seriously. you're talking about morality tales from a 2000 year old story book that also condones slavery and advocates stoning someone for working on the sabbath.
and you also have to consider that most christian political types are like you, talking about the love of christ and how much you hate liberals in the same sentence. if you don't even follow the teachings of peace and forgiveness how do you expect to sway anyone.


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 Originally Posted By: Friendly Neighborhood Ray-man
 Originally Posted By: Wonder Boy


I have a problem with women in non-traditional roles when they neglect their children to pursue their careers, and when they cease having children at replacement-population levels at all.

so free will and how they choose to live their lives should come after some baby-making quota? you do realize the population has gone up 2 or 3 times in just the last 30 years.


but what about the caucasians Ray, what about the caucasians?

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 Originally Posted By: whomod
 Originally Posted By: Friendly Neighborhood Ray-man
 Originally Posted By: Wonder Boy


I have a problem with women in non-traditional roles when they neglect their children to pursue their careers, and when they cease having children at replacement-population levels at all.

so free will and how they choose to live their lives should come after some baby-making quota? you do realize the population has gone up 2 or 3 times in just the last 30 years.


but what about the caucasians Ray, what about the caucasians?

9/11 was caused by some feminists looking to knock down those two penis shaped towers.
you go girl!


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