RKMBs Forums .::Important::. Politics and Current Events Seven Years of Autistic Screeching...

...and the bill doesn't even make it to the floor.

I'm telling you, they're coming back with another round. They'll end up gutting their own party to do it, but this disaster is ongoing...

I was surprised they didn't pass something. Is anybody here actually for what the tea party wants?

I disagree just a little, Sammitch. They've blown this hardcore and the made dash by the likes of Hannity and Pirro to protect Trump really seem to point to how massive of a failure this really was.

They passed plenty of repeals during Obama's tenure that they should've been able to at least put that on the table with the promise to replace in the time that Obamacare got undone. The fact that they didn't makes it clear that the past seven years have been political showboating.

Lastly, healthcare is a large part of GDP. Trump's newest idea of let it blow up is openly rooting for economic meltdown to get what he wants. Such an idea is fucking pathetic.

Do you really think Trump was stupid enough to believe that a "replace" bill was ever going to pass?

No one believed that the establishment republicans would repeal, or even replace, a law that ultimately gives them more power over the people. Forcing a bill now was a demonstration by the executive office to further claim that everyone in Washington--save Trump--is duplicitious, thus adding to the "swamp" narrative.

Joel Pollak's analysis on this debacle was solid: it was an elaborately designed ploy to humiliate Ryan and friends and put them in a weakened position. The people already hate them and love Trump--primarily because they're already aware that the establishment was against him from the get go. As such, Trump can only benefit from republican failures.

Trump campaigned hard for this bill and threatened legislators who didn't vote for it that he'd come after them. He and his surrogates are still talking up Ryan, while blasting the conservatives for not supporting it.

I've said all along that Trump, while leagues better than Clinton, had a Bloombergian moderate streak and his open support for this bill was proof of that.

Trump wasn't the one who passed a series of dead stop repeal bills--while knowing they weren't going to pass--before adopting the "replace" motto to pass yet another bill that's antithetical to the ones that came prior. Keeping this in mind, the onus for this bill's failure will be inherited by Ryan regardless of Trump talking him up since, you know, they hate each other.

Trump and Bannon are situationally aware of these antecedents, which makes it more likely that they're maneuvering Ryan to take a fall without openly feuding. This makes any analysis based on public discourse less than useless. Also, the increasingly relevant non-MSM is running with the narrative that the Freedom Caucus saved the establishment GOP from signing its own death warrant. As such, Ryan is having the spotlight shined on him from every direction.

I'm not necessarily saying that Trump is a crypto-member of the Freedom Caucus, but he's probably not as opposed to them as this political theater would have us believe.

Really, how do you see yourself as any different from the Obamanauts at this point, dude?

There will be no repeal. There will be no repeal and replace. One of his biggest campaign promises cannot be delivered. You bought a lemon the same way the Obamanauts didn't have someone pay their mortgage or go after Wall Street.

But, I'd say it is probably a good thing for you. You may just need Obamacare to make sure that your back surgery is covered from carrying the rancid pond water for this turd so as to create the narrative that he really is draining the swamp.

So, Iggy, the GOPs acknowledged failings on this issue aside, are you happy Obamcare is still the law of the land? I can't quite tell if you're enjoying their failure because you don't like the GOP or because you do like the law or both.

If I had said that Trump's endorsement of Ryan's efforts was cool, then you might have had a point. But I never believed that RyanCare was under serious consideration by congress or the administration. We are far and away from Andrew Jackson and Thomas Jefferson; this is Rome, and we are the lowly plebs trying to scrape by while politicians dazzle us with scripted tragedies. Nothing is real. Everything is an act.



Not with Ryan in charge. Which was my point. He's the principle profiteer of the cheap labor and single payer healthcare lobbies, and he hates Trump. I don't think anyone here--no, not even you--will have the gall to claim that Trump wasn't always aware of this. Keeping this in mind, why would you assume that Trump would bet the farm on a bill written by Ryan?

And, of course, it's comforting to know that some things never change: you will continue to hedge your bets by making moderate critique against the left while shilling your little heart out with virtue-signaling smack directed at the right. Is that the same technique you use in the classroom? Or do you go full social justice warrior just to insure you keep your job?

I'm sorry, but every time someone uses the word "Obamanauts", I can't resist the urge to chime in with "♪doot dooooo de doo doot♫" because it's the perfect pattern of syllables.

The ACA hasn't greatly impacted my life as much as everyone else goes on about how everyone is getting clobbered by it. My insurance rate is dirt cheap once all the wellness discounts are added.

That said, I would be okay if they fixed some of the problems with others facing major premium hikes that could create savings by keeping subsidy payouts down. If breaking down barriers from purchasing insurance from another state helps that, then I am more than happy to see that passed. I'm also cool with reasonable tort reform as a way to bring down costs. Doctors are passing those astronomical malpractice insurance rates on to us. Let's try to bring costs like that down.

But, I also have to exist in reality. Obamacare is here to stay and there is no amount of ideological posturing that can change that fact. Fixing it is the only viable alternative. So, let's focus on what we can do to make it work for everyone as best as it possibly can.

Pariah, get over your alt-right bullshit. It is the same story because the only thing that has changed is the gaggle of unreasonable ideologues and bootlicking sycophants fondling the balls of the new guy holding the levers of power.

You are really not all that different from the Obamanauts and SJWs you spend so much time yammering on about. Sure, this is Rome and you are a bit player and imperial cultist with a knack for empty rhetoric. I've no problem with that.

BTW, how is that Pizzagate thing going for you guys? Have you been forced to mea culpa like your bedfellow, Alex Jones?

Obama was not viewed as anti-establishment. He was fashioned as a kind of "post-racial", intellectually elite deity-figure that would solidify a benevolent, prosperity-bringing Big Brother. He would be--and was--forgiven for every transgression that wasn't outright ignored.

Trump's campaign, on the other hand, propped him up as the anti-establishment, plain-speaking everyman. If that bill had passed. He would not have been forgiven for the lasting damage it would have caused under his watch, Paul Ryan or no. However, since it didn't pass, Ryan gets all the blame (as was intended). If that or a similar bill is successfully reintroduced, Trump will lose the voter bloc that he has built (me included).

Trump's voter-base is filled with ideologues. No argument there. But that's only going to make them less tolerant of any Trump betrayals.

And it's a little bizarre hearing you distance yourself from the alt-right since their proto-culture is one of the principle origins of the '9/11 was a false flag' claim.



Or, perhaps, you're just using critique as a means to neutralize distinguishing characteristics between partisans so as to paint yourself as a non-partisan in the process. Is this an homage to the Frankfurt School or are you trying to emulate Darknight613 (and Animalman)?



Is that a reference to the "God Emperor" meme? If so, then you're misusing it.



1500 pedophiles rounded up in the span of a few months. Numerous overseas pedo rings busted/exposed in Europe. Hundreds of connections being made to Hollywood and the political elite. It's been going fine thus far.

Yeah, I kind of figured you weren't a libertarian anymore.

Since ACA's implementation, none of my employers have offered health insurance, and quite a few of them don't offer full-time hours, so as to be required to. Insurance programs offered to me in the Obama years have been prohibitively ridiculous in price. In addition to premiums that are over double what was offered me before Obamacare ($180 a month vs. 400/month now) the deductible (previously 3,000, now 6,450 !) is so high that I'd be paying for healthcare that I could never realistically use. Combining 400/month premiums with a 6,450 deductible, I'd be paying over $10,000 out of pocket a year before I had the remotest chance of any reimbursement or partial payment.

If you're a state employee (such as a college professor as Iggy is) then sure, great, your plan is paid for by government-subsidized private-sector-employed taxpayer dollars, insulated from the reality the rest of us live in. But at some point the debt-bubble collapses and public sector employees end up living in the same reality as the rest of us.
Obamacare/ACA is a scam. It is a piece of paper that says you have insurance that you can never actually use. Unless you are poor (in which case the taxpayers are picking up the entire tab), or in a group (such as teachers/professors and other public unions) that is insulated and protected from the real impact of Obamacare because they cut a special deal with the Democrat leadership to give their support to the DNC.

The plan was to elect Hillary president, who would have bailed ACA/Obamacare out with trillions more and turned it into a single-payer system. Obamacare was always a deception, and always designed to collapse whose orchestrated collapse was designed to make single-payer (i.e., government-provided healthcare, eliminating private health insurance, i.e. rationed care) the inevitable next step. Trump's election is the only thing that saved us from that happening.

I'm for free-market solutions that increase competition to lower the cost of healthcare, the stuff the Republicans proposed (but were ignored, and excluded) when Obamacare was being drafted in 2010. Such as (1) allowing heathcare insurers to sell across state lines to increase competition and lower prices, (2) tort reform to cap a maximum on medical lawsuits that increase costs, and (3) allow individuals to pool and get group rates. All proposed before, and ignored by Democrats, so they could build the Trojan Horse that is now inside the gates.

"The Freedom Caucus will hurt the entire Republican agenda if they don't get on the team, & fast. We must fight them, & Dems, in 2018!" - Donald Trump

Remember all during the election when I said that I thought Trump would probably turn out to be a moderate republican if elected?

Yeah, I've definitely seen that the Dittoheads are in a tizzy about this provocation from Trump.

And, yes, I guess I have moved past my libertarianism and lined up fairly squarely in what I can only call conditions-based pragmatism. The woo of logistics was just too much. Would love for others to follow suit, but I doubt they will.

Pariah, I can't find anything backing your claim that Pizzagate caught that many pedos. I can find plenty where all that madness led a N Carolinian to go threaten a pizza joint with a shotgun...but nothing about you guys doing something....useful.

I've always been rather arms length in regard to Truthers. I can conceive of a small cabal within the government maybe organizing it. I've said as much on this site. But, missiles being shot at the Pentagon, Darth Cheney ordering it for KBR (even though I do think he did help them profit from it), and other such dipshit theories are...dipshit theories. Alex Jones is an asshat of pure crazy.

Enjoy the ride through crazytown, but--as someone who has passed through and known many folks who reside there--don't become a townie.

Lastly, WB, I didn't vote for Hillary and--with an admitted trepidation--don't see DeVos as an automatic destroyer of public education. Most funding comes from state and local sources. DeVos--as far as I can tell--mostly could do me the solid of getting the federal BoE off my back with some of their more insipid rules. Less time I have to spend dealing with compliance managers and Title (fill in number here) bullshit is more time I'm able to focus on delivering a quality education to my students.

My insurance--if I opted out of the wellness programs--is just about a dollar-to-dollar match with my employer. The heaviest load is that there are no special discounts nor much help from the state for me to add my family. Having the wife and boy on the plan put health, vision, and dental through the roof.

That said, I'm all for giving those ideas you mentioned a try.