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#1224871 - Fri Jan 12 2018 12:05 AM Democrats and Republican Legislators Slam Trump For Harsh Language Describing Immigrant Countries
Wonder Boy
Offline brutally Kamphausened

Registered: Wed Sep 12 2001
Posts: 16851
Loc: A glorious bold new America

Lawmakers slam Trump for referring to Haiti, African allies as 'shithole countries'

 Quote:
WASHINGTON, Jan 11 (Reuters) - President Donald Trump on Thursday questioned why the United States would want to have immigrants from Haiti and African nations, referring to some as "shithole countries," according to two sources familiar with the comments.

Trump's comments, made in the White House, came as Democratic Senator Dick Durbin and Republican Senator Lindsey Graham briefed the president on a newly drafted immigration bill being touted by a bipartisan group of senators, according to the sources, who asked not to be identified.

Other government officials were present during the conversation, the sources said.

The lawmakers were describing how certain immigration programs operate, including one to give safe haven in the United States to people from countries suffering from natural disasters or civil strife.

One of the sources who was briefed on the conversation said that Trump said, "Why do we want all these people from Africa here? They're shithole countries ... We should have more people from Norway."

The second source familiar with the conversation, said Trump also questioned the need for Haitians in the United States.

Many Democrats and some Republican lawmakers slammed Trump for his remarks.

Republican U.S. Representative Mia Love, a daughter of Haitian immigrants, said the comments were "unkind, divisive, elitist, and fly in the face of our nation's values" and called on Trump to apologize to the American people and to the countries he denigrated.

Another Republican Representative, Ileana Ros-Lehtinen, who was born in Cuba and whose south Florida district includes many Haitian immigrants, said: "Language like that shouldn't be heard in locker rooms and it shouldn't be heard in the White House."

Democratic Senator Richard Blumenthal, a frequent Trump critic, said the president's comment "smacks of blatant racism, the most odious and insidious racism masquerading poorly as immigration policy."


TPS PROGRAM

The program that was being discussed at the White House meeting is called Temporary Protection Status. Trump has moved to end the status for immigrants from El Salvador, which could result in 200,000 Salvadorans legally in the United States being deported, and other countries.

The bipartisan Senate plan would attempt to maintain TPS in return for ending or changing a "diversity" lottery program that has been aimed at allowing up to 50,000 people a year from countries with few emigres to the United States.

Asked about Trump's quips, White House spokesman Raj Shah said: "Certain Washington politicians choose to fight for foreign countries, but President Trump will always fight for the American people."

"Like other nations that have merit-based immigration, President Trump is fighting for permanent solutions that make our country stronger by welcoming those who can contribute to our society, grow our economy and assimilate into our great nation," Shah said.

Another source familiar with the meeting said Trump was questioning why the United States should take in unskilled laborers from the countries under discussion and should instead welcome immigrants from nations that can offer skilled workers.

The source said Trump did not intend any slur.




Is it "elitist" and "insulting" if it is demonstrably true?

The U.S. spends 135 billion a year on the burden of illegal immigrants. And 53% of LEGAL immigrants are also on welfare. Is it too much to ask that we more carefully screen who comes into this country, and weed out those who are gaming the system at the expense of us, the taxpayers?

Or is it more important to import more Democrat voters, no matter what kind of scum and financial burden they are?

If these people are desperate to leave these countries because of severe poverty and crime (Haiti, Mexico, nations of Central America and Africa) are they not, in fact "shitholes"?

As they immigrate here, they bring the drugs, poverty, corruption and crime that infests their home countries.

If, for example, armed robbery and kidnapping are rampant in Brazil, is it not a danger to bring millions of Brazilian immigrants to the U.S.? I've had many Brazilian friends tell me how rampant crime is there. Kidnapping of relatives for ransom is prevalent throughout South America. Is there not a danger of bringing kidnappers, drug traffickers and other criminals among legal immigrants. And needless to say, among illegals even more so. That is certainly happening among Mexicans in border states.

Or is it too much to ask that we revise policy to something that protects our citizens and makes that a priority over bringing in immigrants, legal or illegal?

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#1224872 - Fri Jan 12 2018 12:21 AM Re: Democrats and Republican Legislators Slam Trump For Harsh Language Describe Immigrant Countries [Re: Wonder Boy]
Wonder Boy
Offline brutally Kamphausened

Registered: Wed Sep 12 2001
Posts: 16851
Loc: A glorious bold new America


Haiti is the poorest country in this hemisphere, comparable to nations in sub-Saharan Africa. Its military controls the country in a way comparable to how warlords control countries such as Somalia and Sudan. The per capita income there is about $700 per year.

That pretty closely approximates my definition of "shithole".

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#1224873 - Fri Jan 12 2018 12:27 PM Re: Democrats and Republican Legislators Slam Trump For Harsh Language Describe Immigrant Countries [Re: Wonder Boy]
Wonder Boy
Offline brutally Kamphausened

Registered: Wed Sep 12 2001
Posts: 16851
Loc: A glorious bold new America


Trump hits back at outrage over 'tough' immigration language, trashes DACA 'deal'

 Quote:
President Trump hit back Friday at the growing international outrage over reports that he questioned why the U.S. was taking immigrants from “s---hole” countries, while taking aim at a so-called immigration “deal” announced by a group of senators the day before.

In a series of tweets, Trump both defended his immigration stance while claiming the remarks attributed to him weren't accurate.

“The language used by me at the DACA meeting was tough, but this was not the language used. What was really tough was the outlandish proposal made - a big setback for DACA!” Trump tweeted early Friday.


The “language” the president referred to came during talks Thursday with lawmakers at the White House. Despite Trump's denial, multiple sources have confirmed what was said, and the White House did not deny it overnight.

“Why are we having all these people from s---hole countries come here?” the president said, apparently referring to people from Haiti, as well as some Central American and African countries. He reportedly added that the U.S. should admit more people from countries like Norway.

Later Friday morning, Trump went on to deny he said anything "derogatory" about Haitians.

"Never said anything derogatory about Haitians other than Haiti is, obviously, a very poor and troubled country. Never said “take them out.” Made up by Dems. I have a wonderful relationship with Haitians. Probably should record future meetings - unfortunately, no trust!" Trump tweeted.

Utah Republican Rep. Mia Love, a Haitian-American, said the president's comments were "unkind, divisive, elitist, and fly in the face of our nation's values."

Amid the backlash, the president on Friday also slammed the supposed “DACA deal,” which a group senators were hammering out with the goal of extending protection for young illegal immigrants brought to the country as children. Trump on Friday detailed what he thinks is missing from the plan.

“The so-called bipartisan DACA deal presented yesterday to myself and a group of Republican Senators and Congressman was a big step backwards. Wall was not properly funded, Chain & Lottery were made worse and USA would be forced to take large numbers of people from high crime countries which are doing badly,” Trump tweeted Friday.

The reference to high-crime countries seemed to be an explanation of the concerns Trump expressed about certain nations at Thursday's meeting.

The "deal" in question was introduced to the president by a group of six senators—Republican Sens. Lindsey Graham, R-S.C., Jeff Flake, R-Ariz., Cory Gardner, R-Co., and Democratic Sens. Dick Durbin, D-Ill., Michael Bennett, D-Co., and Robert Menendez, D-N.J. They did not detail what was included in their deal.

“We have been working for four months and have reached an agreement in principle that addresses border security, the diversity visa lottery, chain migration/family reunification, and the Dream Act –the areas outlined by the president,” the senators wrote in a joint statement. “We are now working to build support for that deal in Congress.”

DEAL OR NO DEAL? SEVERAL SENATORS CLAIM TENTATIVE AGREEMENT ON IMMIGRATION

Democrats are working to preserve the Obama-era Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals program, which was ended by Trump in September.

Trump has said he will only agree to a deal with Congress on immigration if it includes funding for his wall along the U.S.-Mexico border.

“I want a merit based system of immigration and people who will help take our country to the next level. I want safety and security for our people. I want to stop the massive inflow of drugs. I want to fund our military, not do a Dem defund,” Trump tweeted minutes later.

He added: “Because of the Democrats not being interested in life and safety, DACA has now taken a big step backwards. The Dems will threaten ‘shutdown,’ but what they are really doing is shutting down our military, at a time when we need it most. Get smart, MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN!”

Congress has until Jan. 19 to pass a temporary spending bill to prevent a government shutdown.

The president tweeted again, moments later, blasting Democrats for their approach.

"Sadly, Democrats want to stop paying our troops and government workers in order to give a sweetheart deal, not a fair deal, for DACA. Take care of our Military, and our Country, FIRST!"





Whether or not Trump used those actual words is not the issue. Bottom line, he spoke candidly about the nations we are receiving immigrants from, and of the best interests of the United States in selection of immigrants.

You can argue that Trump is giving his enemies ammunition in his choice of words. But the truth is, the media will ALWAYS find a way to spin what Trump says in a negative light, however carefully worded. (Past examples with other candidates: Romney's "Binders full of women" he would appoint. Romney talking about the dangerous tipping point of 47% dependent on welfare/public benefits, who will always vote for a big-government Democrat. Which was demonstrably true, and actually a lower percentage than others have factually cited. )
I'd rather have a president who addresses the core issues, rather than a president who dances around the issue and never solves it, just because the latter choice polls well, while not solving the problem.

The issue is, based on over 50 years of immigration since 1965:

Which nations give us immigrants who assimilate well, and give us law-abiding highly educated taxpaying patriotic professionals, who assimilate and strengthen us?

And which nations statistically decades later don't assimilate, statistically don't graduate high school and don't pursue higher education, who statistically more often develop multigenerational dependency on welfare, and statistically more often end up in gangs or prison?
"Shithole" indeed!

Democrats seem to have no interest in weeding out MS-13 or Tsarnaev brothers type immigrants, so long as they vote Democrat while collecting their welfare benefits and blowing up the country.

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#1224874 - Fri Jan 12 2018 02:54 PM Re: Democrats and Republican Legislators Slam Trump For Harsh Language Describe Immigrant Countries [Re: Wonder Boy]
Wonder Boy
Offline brutally Kamphausened

Registered: Wed Sep 12 2001
Posts: 16851
Loc: A glorious bold new America



I wanted to show some clips where they specify what precisely was said in the meeting with Trump that solicited the "shithole countries" remark.


The point man on this story breaking seems to be Senator Richard Durbin (D-MI):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w_2CzhrB48Y



The only YouTube clip in the "shithole countries" search I found that was slightly pro-Trump, it summarizes who said what in the meeting. With the context that Trump was, however indelicate, accurate in the fact that these are not great nations to live in, and their immigrants inherently don't offer the greatest skills and work ethic that people of other nations immigrating would:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rVA5yP0LbHQ




And this from French media also briefly sums up what was said, with a lot of editorializing in such a brief clip:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Jigx4xzgpk



What I notice is that when you do a YouTube search on the subject of "Trump shithole countries", what it pulls up is a list of pure anti-Trump accounts. There is no counterpoint whatsoever in what the search pulls up. Just a solid wall of anti-Trump diatribes from CNN, MSNBC, Washington Post, and liberal blogs. Not a single commentary displayed from FOX, WSJ, or any conservative blog or source. Unless you know exactly what to search for by name, not in a general search on the subject:

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=trump+shithole+countries

Project Veritas did an exposure in the last few days of tech people for Twitter, who say they manipulate algorithms to shut out conservative opinion. So that conservatives think no one is responding to their tweets, when in fact, through Twitter manipulation, no one is even able to see what they are Tweeting:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=64gTjdUrDFQ



And most directly to the point, regardles of the "Trump shithole countries" search, Laura Ingraham in her Wednesday 1-10-2018 program gives a great overview of the liberal plan in the current immigration system, and clearly lays out how dire it is to stop this stream of nation-altering third-world immigrants, before it destroys our national sovereignty.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iYN8TSxgADc

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#1224878 - Fri Jan 12 2018 07:45 PM Re: Democrats and Republican Legislators Slam Trump For Harsh Language Describe Immigrant Countries [Re: Wonder Boy]
Matter-eater Man
Offline Fair Play!

Registered: Sat Jun 07 2003
Posts: 13457
And if Trump fucked a baby there probably would be less positive stories. This was the type of thing that made lots in his base jizz a little but it wasn't a good thing. He's a piece of shit so I'm not surprised he talks about other countries in such vulgar terms. In terms of advancing his ideas on immigration I don't see where this helps him out even. Again he might of made his base happy but offended everyone else.

Fair play!

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#1224880 - Sat Jan 13 2018 11:24 AM Re: Democrats and Republican Legislators Slam Trump For Harsh Language Describe Immigrant Countries [Re: Matter-eater Man]
the G-man
Offline Officially "too old for this shit"

Registered: Fri May 16 2003
Posts: 43295
Loc: the right
If they aren't shithole countries why are so many people desperate to leave them?
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#1224886 - Sun Jan 14 2018 09:26 AM Re: Democrats and Republican Legislators Slam Trump For Harsh Language Describe Immigrant Countries [Re: the G-man]
Matter-eater Man
Offline Fair Play!

Registered: Sat Jun 07 2003
Posts: 13457
Why use that offensive language though G? Trump is supposedly for a system based more on merit so a doctor from a shithole country might be more preferable than somebody unskilled from a "good" country. His comments tied immigration to the countries themselves and in a very ugly way.

Fair play!

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#1224889 - Sun Jan 14 2018 04:18 PM Re: Democrats and Republican Legislators Slam Trump For Harsh Language Describe Immigrant Countries [Re: Matter-eater Man]
Wonder Boy
Offline brutally Kamphausened

Registered: Wed Sep 12 2001
Posts: 16851
Loc: A glorious bold new America
 Originally Posted By: Matter-eater Man
Why use that offensive language though G? Trump is supposedly for a system based more on merit so a doctor from a shithole country might be more preferable than somebody unskilled from a "good" country. His comments tied immigration to the countries themselves and in a very ugly way.


I'll again refer to the book State of Emergency by Pat Buchanan (2006), that has a lot of statistics and studies of both legal and illegal immigration.

Over 50 years of statistics, the worst performing nations in terms of high school graduation, pursuit of higher education, perpetual dependence on and abuse of welfare, illiteracy, arrests, crime, incarceration in U.S. prisons, gangs, drug trafficking, and other abuses of the system, who perpetually into multiple generations are most often remaining in poverty, are immigrants from Mexico, Central America, and the Caribbean. And sub-Saharan Africa. In his 2008 book Suicide of a Superpower, Buchanan cites a study that while those from African and other third-world nations improve on test scores when they immigrate and attend school in the United States, they still perform consistently lower than other immigrant groups.

You can point to 1 in 100,000 Mexican or Somalia immigrants who become a doctor. (And you seem to suggest letting in someone who already has that education and skills, which I believe we already do.) But admitting immigrants with no skills is risky from a nation where a 10-year old is statistically more likely to become an incarcerated gang member than a physician.
I said this before: I think we should look at immigration statistics since 1965, and give favored status (regardless of race) to immigrants from nations that statistically/historically for 50-plus years have a high ratio of assimilation by the above criteria (such as Japan, S. Korea, Japan, Europe and Canada), and a more difficult hurdle for immigrants from nations that have a low ratio of assimilation by the above criteria (such as Mexico, Central America, and sub-Saharan Africa).
That's fair, right? And it makes sense and protects the nation.

Another interesting detail Buchanan lists is that the 50 counties in the U.S. with the highest ratio of illegal immigrants are the counties with the lowest wages. Clearly, it is not that Americans won't do the jobs that immigrants do, it's that employers either 1) hire illegals with no interest in U.S. workers or 2) that illegals working under the table for lower wages price the wage so low that no American worker would want it.

In State of Emergency Buchanan cites a U.S. Congressional study that explored what are the professions that are most saturated with illegal immigrants. The job that ranked the highest is dry-wall installation in the construction industry, at 26% illegals. But that means 74% of dry wall installers are Americans!



The one debatable part of Trump's remarks is if he could have said it in a nicer way than "shithole countries".

First off, if you watch Laura Ingraham's opening commentary from Jan 12th(and a second Igraham editorial specifically about Durbin 28 minutes in), she explores Sen. Dick Durbin's record of proven lies, and asks if he is as believable as Trump. Trump and the Republicans who were in the meeting say Trump did not say "shithole countries". Only Durbin of those in the room alleges that.

Buit let's assume Trump DID use the term. If he used a more nuanced term, it would have gone unnoticed. Because he used that term, or is at least alleged to have used that term, it has galvanized debate on the issue. And for many, using that term or not, it has widely raised the notion among voters that these are not countries it is sensible to easily admit immigrants from. And I think that works in Trump's favor, toward the sensible limits and vetting of immigrants Trump is pushing for. That he won a campaign in 2016 on.

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#1224894 - Yesterday at 01:10 PM Re: Democrats and Republican Legislators Slam Trump For Harsh Language Describe Immigrant Countries [Re: Wonder Boy]
Wonder Boy
Offline brutally Kamphausened

Registered: Wed Sep 12 2001
Posts: 16851
Loc: A glorious bold new America

Rand Paul said in the last day or so that Senator Lindsey Graham in the recent past described these same nations as "hell-hole" countries, and no one made any noise about it being allegedly racist.

But where President Trump used almost the same words and said "shit-hole countries", his political opposition goes way off the rails and labels it "racist". Making pretty clear it is political maneuvering and Trump derangement syndrome, and not actual racism.

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