http://www.newsarama.com/DC/Countdown_more/Batman_Hello.htmFucking get the fucking AIDS obsessed fucking cunt off of all comics right now. Fucking no good hack should be publicly shamed for the fucking stunts he's pulled. Fucking liberal piece of shit. Leave AIDS out of comics, and keep Jason Todd dead you fucking ass.
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And finally, for those wondering, yes, Winick was reading Batman in 1988, and, when the time came, he called in and voted for Jason to live. 16 years later, he got his wish.
Fucking ass. The fans voted for him to die and stay dead. Fucking pompous ass. Stop ruining comics.
Im afraid i agree here. Im actually for bringing JT back, but not as a reckless murderer like the current Red Hood apparently is
I was all for him returning when i saw the end of Batman #617, Todd stalking Batman and working under Ra's Al Ghul or Tommy would have been good, seems as though he's just a reckless mercenary now though, i dont even think he's obsessed with Batman or anything....?
I'm hoping the whole infinite crisis thing will somehow erase this shit. Fucking Winick.
Too early to tell about anything, though so far they've shown him to be anything but reckless.
On the bright side, I have a lot more money at the end of every month, thanks to all the books that DC and Marvel are causing me to drop.
I don't mind Winick trying to raise awareness about certain issues.
I just think he's undermining his own cause by doing it on every single book he does. It doesn't seem genuine anymore, but simply a stupid marketing ploy to stir up faux controversy and boost sales.
Exactly why I stopped reading Mark Millar's books.
The only way Winnick could get worse is if he brought back Jason Todd and gave him AIDS.
I don't like the idea of bringing anyone back, but I'm slowly learning to live with the idea that every comic book death is only temporary. That said, I mind it a lot less that he's coming back as a villain and hope they keep him that way.
Also, I think Winick is one of the better writers out there.
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thedoctor said:
The only way Winnick could get worse is if he brought back Jason Todd and gave him AIDS.
DAMMIT! Don't give him ideas!!!!
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I just think he's undermining his own cause by doing it on every single book he does. It doesn't seem genuine anymore, but simply a stupid marketing ploy to stir up faux controversy and boost sales.
Winnick, you fucking asshole.
I swear by all that is holy, if I ever get lucky enough to start my own comic book series, when I kill someone off, they stay dead. They'll never be seen again except for flashbacks, hallucinations, necromancy, or in cases of a costumed character, someone taking over for them. I'm not going to put my reader through shit like this.
I'm glad you all finally see things my way...next stop, Greg Rucka...
How Winick, Grayson, and half the assholes who work on the Bat titles are writing professionally is beyond me.
I'm so glad I dropped the 346 Bat books years ago.
Fuckers.
I didn't read too much of his work, but I'll take your word for it.
Fucking Bat books. For every good Batman book or idea over the years, there's been 5 bad ones. Assholes.
Aaaaaaaaaaaanyway, if you want a good laugh (or a good cry) check out the comments that the Batman zombies have posted on the message board about this farce.
No wonder rex taunted those idiots so much.
I really gotta come up with another id for that site.
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jeez up to five pages already. I didnt even want to read some of the negative opinions im sure are on this board already. I just want to say Thank you if JUdd is reading this. Not since Oneil left and the no mans land saga ended has any of the batman books have been up to par. People understand the neccesity to move forward. All the stories of the pain and guilt Bruce felt for jason's death has been done. Now a whole new bunch of stories come out of him being alive. The last few pages with him beating on the joker brilliant. Sorry but unlike other resuurection this one is so far from trite. It is dynamic in its scope and it turns the whole bat universe upside down. The ramifications will effect Tim, Barbara, the joker , Dick, alfred as well as bruce. Again enjoy the ride people
http://newsarama.com/forums/showthread.p...mp;pagenumber=5
OK, I feel better now.
Go get this one, rex.
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“It was one of the things that myself, Bob Schreck, and Dan Didio talked about from the start,” Winick told Newsarama. “When I was taking over Batman, and after the initial arc, I said I wanted to do something big, and this is what I wanted to do.
This is what drives these damned soap opera melodrama comics. ...I wanted to do something big...
Why can't there be small? Most of my favorite Batman issues are one-shots. One shots totally unconnected to any other plotline. Thank Gob for Alan Grant's run on Batman. At least I have that.
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Pig Iron said:
...next stop, Greg Rucka...
Even worse.
which is worse...jock itch or sweaty balls???
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Pig Iron said:
Rucka..too...
Let it go, Pig Iron......let it go!
Whilst I don't think too much or Rucks writing, he is worlds better than Winnick.
I can only hope that this is not the real Jason todd or that it is his possessed carcas! The guy died, there was a body, he is dead dead dead!
If it is a fake...........nice original story telling, almost a year after Hush!
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ROY BATTY said:
Whilst I don't think too much or Rucks writing, he is worlds better than Winnick.
Better in some areas, bad in others. But both still can't write for shit.
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ROY BATTY said:
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Pig Iron said:
Rucka..too...
Let it go, Pig Iron......let it go!
never I say..I just don't like his stories they are boring and uninteresting...don't like any of his marvel stuff, his superman is bad, his batman is bad, gotham central is ok, and wonder woman is not good either..I don't know i think he's useless other than writing stuff like whiteout or novels...
Actually, I really liked his stuff until right after NML. Him and Brubaker headed that project and it was great--It was the bloody peak of talent in the Batverse! Then a few months after, things went Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay down hill. All the new writers just took a major U-turn and started sucking. And if I didn't know any better, they were sucking on purpose!
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Pariah said:
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ROY BATTY said:
Whilst I don't think too much or Rucks writing, he is worlds better than Winnick.
Better in some areas, bad in others. But both still can't write for shit.
Agreed!
But Winnick has a special way of writing about kamphausen type characters - this is far more annoying for me than Rucksters shit!
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Pig Iron said:
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ROY BATTY said:
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Pig Iron said:
Rucka..too...
Let it go, Pig Iron......let it go!
never I say..I just don't like his stories they are boring and uninteresting...don't like any of his marvel stuff, his superman is bad, his batman is bad, gotham central is ok, and wonder woman is not good either..I don't know i think he's useless other than writing stuff like whiteout or novels...
dude, I don't disagree with you, I'm just worried! can you take any tablets for this? You're developing animalman tendencies!
I agree that winick is worse...outsiders was the worst drivel i have ever read..if it wasn't for tom raney i wouldn't have made it 3 issues...
how can a competent writer mess up a book with arsenal, nightwing, jade, etc..?
Oh wait, Devin Grayson did that too...
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Pig Iron said:
I agree that winick is worse...outsiders was the worst drivel i have ever read..if it wasn't for tom raney i wouldn't have made it 3 issues...
how can a competent writer mess up a book with arsenal, nightwing, jade, etc..?
Oh wait, Devin Grayson did that too...
that's what I'm saying.
Rucky is evil but Pips like Gayson, loebo and Winnich are eviler! Kamphausener evil!
...winich has been treading the line of shit to all out wank shit but his batman is surpassing all that! Jason Todd. That's not sraping the bottom of the barrell, he's gone thru the barrell and messing with indian burial ground shit!
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Pig Iron said:
Oh wait, Devin Grayson did that too...
Her ghostrider was one of the worse things I have ever read!
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Pig Iron said:
how can a competent writer mess up a book with arsenal, nightwing, jade, etc..?
pretty fucking hard!
Ok, I'll buy that, I'll even try wonder woman again when rags morales starts drawing it.. you drive a hard bargain..
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ROY BATTY said:
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Pig Iron said:
Oh wait, Devin Grayson did that too...
Her ghostrider was one of the worse things I have ever read!
OH. MY. GAWD.
Who's brilliant idea was it to put Grayson on Ghost Rider for fuck's sakes!?
They even gave him starfire....what is the point of the uninteresting tattoo chick, and the weird japanese girl robot, and the daughter of black lightning could be cool if she wasn't written badly...
And how lame was his death of donna troy? that was pathetic...
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ROY BATTY said:
dude, I don't disagree with you, I'm just worried! can you take any tablets for this? You're developing animalman tendencies!
That's not true!
He's not right all the time like me!
hmmm
i'm torn on this one.
i'm definately of the mind that bringing Jason Todd back from the dead is a bad idea. the original "Death in the Family" was a great tale and Todd's death was airtight. it's impact on Batman is still felt today, Todd's death being his greatest failure and all. this story doesn't need to be told, Todd was already more useful in death than in life.
that being said i was enjoying the books leading up to this revelation and i think that there just might be the possibility of a decent story coming out of this. call me naive, call me optimistic but i'm willing to admit that i might possibly be wrong about this storyline.
then again, Winnick (who has turned me off both Grren Lantern and Green Arrow) could screw this up really easy.
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Pig Iron said:
And how lame was his death of donna troy? that was pathetic...
Right you are Pig Iron. I wasn't surprised to read that she's coming back from the dead.
Sheesh . . . and people wonder why I'm not interested in reading any of the comics DC puts out.
I'm not sure why everyone is so upset about this most recent "development", I've been telling you people for a while now that these so-called "writers" are nothing but a bunch of talentless hacks who can barely put together a readable stunt let alone actually write a good story.
It's nice to see people can finally see what i've been talking about.
Shut the fuck up. You hate all comics. We still like/love some of them. Sure there are some bad writers, but that doesn't mean all comics suck. Just because judd winick is a fucking AIDS propogandist, doesn't mean that Bendis sucks also.
Or Morrison. Or... um...
Morrison is pretty good!
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rex said:
Just because judd winick is a fucking AIDS propogandist, doesn't mean that Bendis sucks also.
Yet somehow they both do suck!
Whatever you say, Oakley.
Bendis doesn't suck..his storytelling technique doesn't work for all stories though..I liked the first 50 issues of ultimate spidey...powers was good while i read it and new avengers is great...
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Animalman said:
Whatever you say, Oakley.
WHOA, CALM DOWN, BUDDY!
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rex said:
Just because judd winick is a fucking AIDS propogandist, doesn't mean that Bendis sucks also.
Actually Bendis does suck.
Pick a good example....Like say Brian K. Vaughn.
I haven't read that many of his comics, but he is good.
His matches malone story in batman was one of the best bat stories in ten years..
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Pig Iron said:
Bendis doesn't suck..his storytelling technique doesn't work for all stories though..I liked the first 50 issues of ultimate spidey...powers was good while i read it and new avengers is great...
I actually really liked his Daredevil run, though it reads a lot better in TPB than individual issues. I also liked Torso. A lot of his other stuff, however, is too slow paced even for my tastes, and I usually prefer the slower paced stuff.
He and Millar are the two most overhyped and overrated writers out there, in my opinion.
Bendis's Daredevil is probably one of the all time greatest runs in comics.
ultimate sis good and a few of bendis'things are good..they aren't morrison or moore though..not even close..i think millar is still mad that his best loved stories were ghost written by morrison..hahahahahhah
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Pig Iron said:
His matches malone story in batman was one of the best bat stories in ten years..
I agree with Pig Iron.
I on the other hand can't agree with anything that anybody says. Especially when they agree with me!
I got the comic (Batman 638) and read it today. Although I hate that DC continuously brings back the dead and I hate that they desecrated the sanctity of killing Jason Todd - the bigest thing to happen to Batman since his parents' deaths - I liked it. I like it for one reason and one reason only: Jason got to get revenge. He got to beat the fuck outta Joker with a goddamn crowbar. THAT's funny. That's what Babs never got to do. Just for that bit right there, I'm cool with it. That was damn fine.
babs should get to rape the joker for revenge!
That's a pretty fucked up and stupid reason, especially considering the way the book characterized Joker.
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Pariah said:
That's a pretty fucked up and stupid reason, especially considering the way it characterized Joker.
Well, seeing as he's fucked off to a nunnary to brood over his loss of power in Gotham since he was kicked about by Hush and seems to be on the downswing of his semi-permenant Manic, I'd say they were trying to establish a new mental state for Joker. Like it or not, it's happening. They revealed his fucking origin, fer chrissakes. And after the awkward-ass way he was made to act in the storyarc Hush, this seems to be playing out somewhat logically, IMO.
Last Laugh he gets all riled up to take out the world 'cause he's gonna die. Then he gets killed (like that's never happened 
) by severe beating and rec... brought back alive. Then he gets in cahoots with Hush to try and make Batman kill him without doing anything wrong (at that point in time) = beat the fuck up. Then someone gives him his past in solid terms, there's a guy and he killed Joker's wife and kid = outlet for dealing with Joker's origional 'one bad day' and revenge for his former self's emotional distress. = no longer the prick we know and love, Joker just got to do something about life's ultimate joke. He got to turn it around and get a sort of justice out of it.
As much as I hate that story, it did a shitload to open up for character changes. It's like the controversy about Joe Cool and Batman. Joe Cool's death could have (if it weren't for the need to sell the comics) destroyed The Bat-Man. He could have found reason to give up vigilante justice and join the police force. He could have decided 'oh fuck, we are both killers' and quit alltogether for a life of brooding without the escapades on the rooftops. Lots could have happened and there's buckets of innane internet chatter to back that up (DCMB had a couple threads about it pre-MB-crisis).
Back on subject, now Joker is open to basically any kind of new mental or emotional state a writer could desire. He's an open book. Just like when Harley was first introduced, this is new territory for the Joker's character. Only, unlike with Harley, this new change is regarding the core of his dementia. So when Hush comes and challanges Joker and kicks him down, they decided to swing Joker from manic to depressive. He's not the same guy anymore - they made that blatent when he strips off his suit and wanders back to his past to live. Not a pretty sight and not at all what I would have wanted in a billion years, but it happened. And it's something I've decided to come to terms with in order to continue enjoying comics. So when Jason Todd returns and tracks Joker to his pity-party in the old amusement park and beats him up with a crowbar, kicking the man while he's down as justice for Jason's life-ending adventure with Uncle J, I find it almost poetic in hjow gleeful it is that finally someone gets one in on the impervious Joker.
Whether or not it's correct to current continuity (which, inexplicably, is totally ignorant of the not retconned continuity that came before it--That, BTW, this current cont. still uses as its backdrop) is not the concern. Joker is a horrible stupid dumbass character now. A fucking joke. Exactly what he didn't want to be ever again. They killed a good thing--Leiberman killed a good thing, and Winnick decided to procrastinate. That's not something I can enjoy especially since his change was, actually, unabbreviated and unsubstantiated in the first place.
Like I said, I've decided to come to terms with that since there's nothing I can do about it and like reading Batman comics. So that is not my issue. It's not like I don't still have all my good Joker comics. And they seem to want everything in the Bat comics to change (even quality!).
And in that rite I think you've sold out. I don't change my tastes according to the writer's whim, I likes what I likes and I don't tolerate what I don't likes or else the writer will get the idea that he's shitting gold when really it's just regular ol' shit.
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britneyspearsatemyshorts said:
babs should get to rape the joker for revenge!
With a crowbar!
No! No! With a wheelchair!
Sellout schmellout. I quit reading Batman comics and realized, 'I miss reading Batman comics.' So I'm buying them again. I don't like what they do a lot of the time, but it's still, at the core, one of my favorite characters.
During the Hush run I wanted nothing but to read a Batman comic I liked. So, for a long-ass time, I've been working on just that. Two thirds of it are posted on my website, the rest will be there sooner or later. I learned a couple things during this time. I suck at writing, that's the first thing. The other thing - continuity is boring. I mean the nit-picky bits. I don't want to research through my comic collection to decide what kinda underwear to make Green Lantern wear. Major continuity is valuable, but if I didn't read or like the story I didn't use it. Three, static characters are good for starting out because you know who they are and they fit and you can be lazy while writing them. It would take a good writer to make a progression in the character - even if it makes a lot of us mad because it's a fucking stupid progression. Sometimes it works. I like how they made Penguin be just Oswald Cobblepot. I like that Catwoman doesn't wear an ugly purple unitard and I like that she finally got a damn haircut. I hate that they've neutered Joker's character but thems the apples.
It's just one world in the comics I love. This is just Batman. I have a bunch of series of comics that are pristine and beautiful in their stability of character. Those series stopped at the right time. Batman never stopped. Although it would be nice and would feel wonderful to always pick up a Batman comic and have everything the same as always, there would be no writers willing to work like that. It's stupid. I still wish they'd put in more one-shots because those are better than any story arc I have ever read, but maybe someone will do those again in the future. They didn't stop the Batman franchise so it has to move onward. We have the ability now to buy and save our favorite comics. They will always exist. That doesn't mean we should always have the same thing. If Kelly Jones and whoever the fuck wrote for him were on Batman forever I would shoot myself. Things happen and I'm sure Batman will turn once more towards my tastes sometime in the next ten years or so. In the meantime I'll just enjoy what I can out of what they are producing and find my comic thrills and amazement in the other books in other 'universes.'
I'm not nitpicking shit Uschi. These comic characters are no longer the ones that I fell in love with. I'm not saying change is bad, but if you're gonna do it, make sure you be smart about it and make sure you're not changing the wrong things--Not to mention support your changes with the previous character. There's nothing about them that I like or are similar to what I liked, which is why I started reading them. And as far as I can see, that's pretty much the case with you and you're putting up with it just to see a guy in a Bat-suit. You're not even using Mxy's backdrop here (story).
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Pariah said:
I'm not nitpicking shit Uschi.
Oh, don't get me wrong, I wasn't implying anything about your comments with that. I was mostly thinking DCMB and myself.
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These comic characters are no longer the ones that I fell in love with.
Me either. It really crushed me when they destroyed Joker. It was the last straw and my enjoyment of Batman comics will mever again reach such levels as it has for the previous whole of my life.
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I'm not saying change is bad, but if you're gonna do it, make sure you be smart about it and make sure you're not changing the wrong things--Not to mention support your changes with the previous character. There's nothing about them that I like or are similar to what I liked, which is why I started reading them. And as far as I can see, that's pretty much the case with you and you're putting up with it just to see a guy in a Bat-suit.
Yeah. I know. But that is the way it is and, like I mentioned, there isn't a fucking thing I can do about it. And there's no reason for me to give up because of a storybook. The Batman comics used to be my life. Now they're just an entertaining distraction. I can't afford to put any stock in a bulk-rate comic so I won't anymore.
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You're not even using Mxy's backdrop here (story).
Ummmmmmmmmm you lost me here.
Just clarification. These changes aren't microscopic like GL's underwear. They're HUGE changes based on blatant mistakes. Even so, the psychology within the Bat books should not be passed over like so much worthless jargin. It's important enough to the whole purpose of the characters to go over with a fine tooth comb.
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Uschi
Ummmmmmmmmm you lost me here.
Eh. Inside joke. He'll know what I mean. It's irrelevent.
Anyway.....Fine. But you're bein' all dumb n' stuff.
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Pariah said:
Just clarification. These changes aren't microscopic like GL's underwear.
I know that. It was just something I realized while attempting my own full-legnth comic. Again, I was refering to the DCMB and myself in that.
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Pariah said:
Anyway.....Fine. But you're bein' all dumb n' stuff.
Yeah? Well you're a stupid fat-head.
*obligatory "get a room" post*
Kay fine. I'm gonna go eat breakfast. So fuck off.
I'm starting to believe what someone once said in a letters column, that the only comic book characters that stay dead are Bruce Wayne's parents.
At least I knew how to kill Batfreak repeatedly with a more sadistic style, and even though Stupidman ended my reign, he absorbed Batfreak's bitter aftertaste and therefore had to get a therapist.
Never send a comic hack to do a psychopath's job.
They killed Barry Allen. They villified and killed Hal Jordon. They killed Maxie Zeus. They forgot Garfield Lynns. They destroyed Joker. They've retardified Scarecrow. Some of them have even defamed Batman's character. DC is nothing but an entertaining distraction, any merit I found inherent in the books I first read and enjoyed has been raped of it's beauty. It's a collection of storybooks starring my favorite pajama guy. Why make it into anything more? Why expect anything more? It's just comics. Not art, not literature, just comics.
Holy crap on a cracker ... Rex and I FINALLY AGREE ON SOMETHING!!! THE WORLD'S COMING TO A FUCKING END!!!!
?
What do we agree on? Seriously, I don't know what post your commenting on.
i think you guys agree capt marvel ripped off superman.
Because he's a goddamn villain. He killed those guys.
Winick. Being. A. Fucking. Hack.
Ring any bells?
What does have to do with Captain Marvel being a Superman rip-off?
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ShazamGrrl1 said:
Holy crap on a cracker ... Rex and I FINALLY AGREE ON SOMETHING!!! THE WORLD'S COMING TO A FUCKING END!!!!
I'm glad that you finally realize that Captain Marvel is nothing but a villainized version of Superman.
welcome to the real world shazamgirrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrl
Captain Marvel is the EVIL SUPERMAN. Like Bizarro, but with the added superpower of grammar.
Green Lantern wears Wonder Woman Underoos.
Feh, it's a tie between the "Captain Marvel's a Supes Rip-off" squad for the "Biggest Fucktard of the Millenium" contest. You're all idiots.
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ShazamGrrl1 said:
Feh, it's a tie between the "Captain Marvel's a Supes Rip-off" squad for the "Biggest Fucktard of the Millenium" contest. You're all idiots.
Between the "Captain Marvel's a Supes Rip-off" squad and what for "Biggest Fucktard of the Millenium" contest?
'Cuz being between something indicates there's two things you're comparing.
But you knew that.
Why is she still here? What is wrong with her?
the obsession continues...
Hey, I created a character called Jeremy for a story I wrote online last year! Fucking plagiarist! Change your damn name!
I bet your character isn't as cool as I am.
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Jeremy said:
I bet your character isn't as cool as I am.
Well, he doesn't wear those nifty sunglasses.
Jason Todd should have stayed dead, hisstory was perfect as it was.
This is all totally out of character.
I was really enjoying this arc up till now.
AND WHY THE FUCK WOULD HE HAVE HIS MASK ON UNDER THE FUCKING HOOD
Maybe it's comfortable? Could be made of satin or velvet or something like that.
And unless he is tied in to Hush some way, why the fuck is he wearing a red mask?????
Fuck!
Right now we aren't supposed to be askin the 'Why' or 'how' of anything... didn't you read the artical?
Why and how was this story even allowed to happen?
