Originally Posted By: First Amongst Daves
Moderate Muslim commentator on Australian news this morning deploring the attack and saying these people are on the fringe of the fringe.


Like clockwork.

It's just as Matt Stone and Trey Parker said: as long as a nation claims there's cultural division in a war, it can still go to war, but seem like the picture of tolerance and concern. That's Islamic culture to a tee. While the commentator is shaking my hand, I am suitably distracted so that the alleged "fringe" can cut it off.

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We had a thing here after the Lindt cafe attack. If you were Muslim and felt intimidated riding public transport because of the risk of being assaulted by non-Muslims, there was a Twitter hashtag, #illridewithyou so non-Muslims would protect Muslims from those sorts of reprisals. Seems to have worked as there was no backlash reported in the media.


Dave. How is that you, the lawyer, are unable to detect the speciousness here?

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And that is because Western values of tolerance are better than that.


And this is the kind of arrogance that is killing us off as a culture. It's a real life Red Wedding and we're Robb Stark.

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Having said that, The Economist asks when Islam will have it's Martin Luther Reformation moment.


Jesus. H. Fucking. Christ.

I hope you're just trying to be funny and not actually simpatico with that. Otherwise, I'll have to call you IggyPro junior.

 Originally Posted By: Prometheus
Yes, Muslim Extremists are very violent, and the Sharia Law is inherently violent or oppressive to others that don't share their beliefs. Moreso than Christians seem to have proven in at least the last century. Going backwards in history, though, you find more and more atrocities at least linked to the Christian Religion/Roman Catholic Church. But, just due to the very fact the Western culture seemed to jump a couple stages ahead of Third World countries in the 19th/20th centuries, would suggest that it might be possible for Muslims, and Sharia Law, to find some moderation in the decades to come.


 Originally Posted By: Iggy
When your religion has, at least, 1300 years (see, Constantinian Dynasty to 17th century wars of religion...at least) of Christian on Christian, Christian on Pagan, Christian on Jew, and Christian on Muslim violence...please...save me your righteous indignation. Who knows, they are about 1300 years into their violent history too. Maybe, they'll just say "Fuck it" like most of Christianity did in the seventeenth century.


In Pro's defense, it's very possible he wasn't aware how backhanded and stupid he was being. Iggy, on the other hand was shooting for Biggest Douche in the Galaxy award.


I'm not particularly certain why the left chooses to view faith-based religious movements as a study in cyclical behavioral phenomena, as though each one has to go through a period of violence and cruelty before adopting civility......Actually, I know exactly why. It's because they were fed disinformation about the Catholic Church and the Crusades and they've chosen to run with it for the better part of the past 800 years and subsequently lump all faiths together indiscriminately.

Whether or not the left chooses to acknowledge it most of the time, modern Western Culture was founded on Christian values--however diluted it may have become, the influence is still undeniably present. And as I told both Iggy and Pro, the only points in history when the people were offered reprieve from Legalistic and/or Theocratic oppression is when the free will-based Christian philosophy had a foothold.

Consider for a moment that all of the Muslims who are speaking against these "fringe" elements are based in Western culture. They have had to assimilate in a Christian influenced venue prior to taking these (erroneous) positions. Keeping this in mind, it's apparent that the allegedly Muslim detractors aren't criticizing these "fringes" from a position of Muslim Protestantism, but rather Christian morality veiled as Islamic civility.