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Beardguy.MOTA said you were simple-minded...
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Quote:
Pig Iron said:
Simple minded children??? Hahhahahahahahhahahahhahahahahah.
Stan Lee's wording, not mine.
Simple minded children and simple minded adults were the target audience of the 60's.
Am I the only one that saw the History Channel's special?
Comics are like a Rorschach test; everyone has a different opinion on what they are and can be...
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I see miniature Dead People..... 
"I offer you a Vulcan prayer, Mr Suder. May your death bring you the peace you never found in life." - Tuvok. 
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I'm NOT simple minded..The voices in my head told me so... 
"I offer you a Vulcan prayer, Mr Suder. May your death bring you the peace you never found in life." - Tuvok.
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Stan Lee can't remember shit and all I have to say is that children of that era were more educated thna the youth of today. They wholesome ideals were a thing of TV as well..not necessarily a thing in reality and action.
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Comics are like a Rorschach test; everyone has a different opinion on what they are and can be...
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Quote:
Beardguy57 said:
I'm NOT simple minded..The voices in my
head told me so...
See..complex....probably even as a child...
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I learned MY ideals from Watching Leave it to Beaver, The Brady Bunch, My Mother the Car, Classic Star Trek and Lost in Space. I learned : Ward should NOT be so hard on the Beaver. That Mom always said Never play ball in the House. That Mom needs an oil change. That if you wear a Red shirt on Star Trek you are a Future corpse. And that talking Bubble Headed Robots are our friends, but watch out for Dr Smith, he is an asshole. I am a Baby boomer : Born in 1957 
"I offer you a Vulcan prayer, Mr Suder. May your death bring you the peace you never found in life." - Tuvok.
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Comics are like a Rorschach test; everyone has a different opinion on what they are and can be...
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My mom says DC sucks! Go with indy!  How she's older than Beardo, I dunno. I think she's immortal.
He fixes the cable?
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Oddly enough I'll show more respect to a fan of the original Trek than I would a fan of Silver Age comics.
I guess it has more to do with the fact that those fans don't whine about wanting Kirk to be immortal or some other stupid thing like that...
Comics are like a Rorschach test; everyone has a different opinion on what they are and can be...
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Indy???? " Indy! Give me the Idol, I throw you the Whip! " 
"I offer you a Vulcan prayer, Mr Suder. May your death bring you the peace you never found in life." - Tuvok.
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Quote:
Not my continuity, that's the concept.
I still don't see why it's so hard for people to understand it.
Rocketed from the doom planet Krypton, the last son of Krypton, only one of his kind, etc.
Again, there's nothing in the early Siegel/Shuster material that says nobody else made it out. They never definitively stated it either way. Further, their Krypton was a utopia, which you have railed against for being inherently degrading to the idea of Krypton being an alien world. Worse yet, you have gone out of your way in the past to claim that Siegel and Shuster got their own creation/concept all wrong and that only Byrne/Jurgens has done it right.
So really, you're not arguing for the concept, because you've already debased the creators of that concept and their treatment of their own creation. You're really arguing for the Byrne/Jurgens version of that concept at the expense of all else and verbally lynching anyone who doesn't feel that way. THAT is the issue at hand, not your imagined "everyone wants the Silver Age revived" conspiracy.
Last edited by King Krypton; 2004-01-07 5:31 AM.
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Quote:
ManofTheAtom said:
Oddly enough I'll show more respect to a fan of the original Trek than I would a fan of Silver Age comics.
I guess it has more to do with the fact that those fans don't whine about wanting Kirk to be immortal or some other stupid thing like that...
I never felt any personal anymosity towards you MOTA. I always thought your opinions were amusing as they strayed so opposite my own and your inflexibility seemed paradoxical in context to your ramblings. i liked that you stuck to your opinion as much as I didn't agree with it.When next we meet my opinion of you and my tone towards you will not be the same. You attacked and berated me because I didn't agree with you. You equate satire with dislike and below the belt punches. I am convinced now that I just don't like you. And when I post again you will know it.
Last edited by Pig Iron; 2004-01-07 5:31 AM.
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Quote:
My point is: you want your version of Superman to be the only one, ok. But where does that leave the other fans? Why can only one part have their version?
This has nothing to do with the Silver Age or the Modern Age: if you were defending the Silver Age the way you're defending the Golden Age I'd say the same things to you.
Ditto. And in fact, I've said much the same thing countless times before.
What I want to see with Superman is integration, a fusion of every incarnation ever done. Be it a mix and match of elements from all the different eras (Birthright, the animated series) or a a wholesale fusion of everything that's ever been done (see Alan Moore's Supreme for an example of how this could be accomplished), I want ALL of Superman's 66-year history to count in some way, for the character to be shaped by ALL of his mythology. I don't want one incarnation to take precedence over all the others. Again, I've said this countless times, and I will no doubt have to say it again until it finally sinks in.
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Original Star Trek was unique upon it's
Debut in Fall 1966 because there had Never
been anything like it before.
I remember I had done something to piss my
father off only a few weeks into that first
season. I was punished : NO Star Trek that night!
Determined to see Star Trek that night, I hid under
my parent's bed. The Show came on.
It was the one where Spock takes the Enterprise
to the home planet of the large brained life
forms known as the Talosians. He has taken his
former Commanding office, Captain Christopher
Pike back to that planet where we see the First
Pilot for the show integrated into the new series.
It was AWESOME. I remember saying, " Wow..... "
when the phaser cannon was firing at the entrance
to the cave where Captain Pike had been kidnapped
by the Talosians.
At Episodes ' End, my father leaned over under
the bed.
" You enjoy that show?? " He asked me.
" Oh Yes!! " I said, blushing as I came out
from under bed..
Years later, I felt the same sense of awe
watching the First Alien movie.... and the following
summer, when Empire Strikes Back was NEW in theaters..
And a whole army of movies came after that,
and now I am really into the Lord of The Rings
trilogy..It's Fan Fucking Tastic!
The Point is : The old stuff is COOL....and
there will ALWAYS be cool NEW stuff to enjoy,
too.
"I offer you a Vulcan prayer, Mr Suder. May your death bring you the peace you never found in life." - Tuvok.
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Actually my favorite Superman is the Adventures of Superman TV show style supes. That is the way he should be handled IMO. It was also Weisinger produced. He would occassionally leta villain or criminal die. There was humor and a hint of goofiness. there was also an underlying moral seriousness.
That is Superman....
Last edited by Pig Iron; 2004-01-07 5:15 AM.
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Quote:
ManofTheAtom said:
KKK
Bullshit.
You're the one that opened a Byrne Fans are the Talliban thread right here before they remade the board.
Because you were spewing hatred at people for daring to appreciate anything that came before 1986-1999 and lashing out at those who dared to have a differing opinion from you. That, and you and your ilk were raking Waid and Wagner over the coals simply because Birthright and Trinity dared to be more about telling a story than to slavishly copying every tiny detail Byrne laid out for the sake of "continuity."
Like I said, I have no use for extremists like you. And I notice that you've deliberately gone out of your way to avoid the fact that I have said, on countless occasions, that I have no beef with those who liked the Byrne/Jurgens era, only the extremists like you. And this was before I went after you and your ilk.
Quote:
You can deny it but you're the kind of asshole that opens hate filled threads that insult others.
There you go, talking to yourself again. You really ought to seek professional help.
Seriously, I think it's rich that you can spam tons of MBs with your hate speech and anti-anything not Byrne/Jurgens dogma, but you cry victim whenever someone gives you a taste of your own medicine. Don't feed me your lies, MOTA. It's YOU who's the bad guy here. Nobody else, not even me, is the one who's become notorious even at comic book news sites for being a crazed zealot and a hypocrite. Am I a saint? No. But you brought this all on yourself. Don't even try to pin the blame on anyone else.
Quote:
Hell, Pig Iron opened this thread with an insult directed towards me.
Which you richly deserved countless times over. Besides, you've already become an online joke. You brought this on yourself, you take your lumps. That's what everybody else does when they screw up.
Last edited by King Krypton; 2004-01-07 5:29 AM.
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I like Lois and Clark ...a Lot!!!
You either hate the Show or ya Loved it.
No middle ground. It was campy. It was Dumb.
It was Cute, and often well written.
Of ALL the Actors who played Superman, Dean
Cain is my favorite. He brought life to the roll.
He even LOOKED kinda like Supes did around 1940 or
so, a Bit.
I liked all the interaction with his parents.
That was done well. And his relationship with
Lois..It was very realistic.
He didn't just go around punching out bad guys.
There was plenty of good Dialogue.
I have maybe 50 episodes of it on tape.
I like Smallville, but I'm NOT a Teen so I
don't relate to it as I do to Lois & Clark,
but it's a Great show. Have many of this show
on Tape.
"I offer you a Vulcan prayer, Mr Suder. May your death bring you the peace you never found in life." - Tuvok.
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I liked Lois & Clark..it was an interesting take...and also had a thin Luthor..Fat luthor is the one thing Byrne did besides proto-supergirl that I hated.
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I like Thin Luthor Better, he looked TOO
KingPin - ish when he was heavier.
And I SOoooo Loved it when Clark did that
" Spin Thing " to change into Superman.
Favorite Episodes :
When Lois & Clark First Meet H.G. Wells
and go back in time to Smallville, circa 1866.
When Clark loses his memory after he tries to
stop the Nightfall asteroid from hitting Earth.
When Clark is first exposed to Kryptonite and loses
his powers.
The episode where He proposes to Lois, and then the
next episode where she tells him , " That all depends
on who's asking - Clark, Or Superman? " and takes his
glasses off as she says this. Wow....
The episode where this crazy guy wants to put HIS head
on Clark's body.
The one where Clark is trapped in the time portal
by Tempus.
The episode where Lois FINALLY got her memory back.
Ultra Woman!! Loved that one!
The four part New Krypton Saga.
And the one where this guy switches Bodies
with Clark... and Lois says early on in this one,
" I can see your soul in your eyes. " and THIS
is what tells her it's Clark in this body.
Great Episodes!
"I offer you a Vulcan prayer, Mr Suder. May your death bring you the peace you never found in life." - Tuvok.
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I, Too, liked the Ultra Woman episode.
...Teri Hatcher in tight pink spandex...
who wouldn't like that episode? Besides Gob, that is.
First National Bastard
-Enormous, Sexually Voracious Lecher... who wants to claim your immortal soul!!!.
Every time you masturbate, God Kills a kitten! Please... think of the Kittens.
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!!!!!
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You're a fucking idiot!! I said, CLEAR AS DAY, that Siegel and Shuster werent' born with the knowledge of everything about Superman, that it wasn't till they worked on Superboy that they got a better handle on the concept. Once they got to work on the characters background they got a better understanding of it. This happens all the time with writer, you stupid fuck. Byrne and Jurgens were working off what those two had done overall, not just a year or two back in the fucking 40's. The conclusion, based on the work, was that Clark was the real person over the fake Superman, you idiot. If you'd bother to read the fucking comics and had a working brain you'd see this, but you're too fucking worried about Stupidgirl and the lack of animals with capes that you can't see it. Quote:
King Krypton said:
Quote:
Not my continuity, that's the concept.
I still don't see why it's so hard for people to understand it.
Rocketed from the doom planet Krypton, the last son of Krypton, only one of his kind, etc.
Again, there's nothing in the early Siegel/Shuster material that says nobody else made it out. They never definitively stated it either way. Further, their Krypton was a utopia, which you have railed against for being inherently degrading to the idea of Krypton being an alien world. Worse yet, you have gone out of your way in the past to claim that Siegel and Shuster got their own creation/concept all wrong and that only Byrne/Jurgens has done it right.
So really, you're not arguing for the concept, because you've already debased the creators of that concept and their treatment of their own creation. You're really arguing for the Byrne/Jurgens version of that concept at the expense of all else and verbally lynching anyone who doesn't feel that way. THAT is the issue at hand, not your imagined "everyone wants the Silver Age revived" conspiracy.
Comics are like a Rorschach test; everyone has a different opinion on what they are and can be...
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Ok, after reading P.I.'s last message I've gone through all 10 pages and I owe him and the bastard (it's your nick, don't take it personallty) an apology.
Mxy, as I've thought before about him, can be reasoned with when he wants to, so he gets one too.
King Krypton, though, can burn in hell for all I care...
I hope you three accept it in the spirit it's given.
I just read all ten pages and noticed a tremendous inconsistancy in my behaviour towards you and the only explanation I can think of for it is that things outside this particular conversation have pissed me off and I've used that anger against you when it wasn't merited (specially P.I. and the bastard).
Comics are like a Rorschach test; everyone has a different opinion on what they are and can be...
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Comics are like a Rorschach test; everyone has a different opinion on what they are and can be...
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OK...not expected..but thank you.
I still wholeheartedly disagree about the lone Kryptonian aspect.
I think Krypto is Ok..not a fan so much.
Linda/Matrix is a dumb idea
Superboy clone..I still have no opinion of.
kandor is dumb.but certainly quirky.
I have no problm with imaginary tales.
I like a thin businessman luthor more than the mad scientist.
I have no problem leaving the silver age in the silver age.
I hate half assed attempts at bringing back a charcter in a new way..when the old one was fine...ala Kara/linda/matrix/???/?????etc.
I prefer a superman that can't push planets.
I love most silver age comics, as much for the energy and purity of the condensed stories.
I love most bronze age comics.
I like many new comics, but most are written and drawn by people who shouldn't have the job they have IMO. So I don't buy that many anymore.
I'm 31..I'm 3 years older than you ..basically the same age..I just had an older brother.
continuity is a a state of mind. How much has superman aged since 1986? To a new reader Superman's history since 1986 must be just as difficult to understand as any other period. That story is basically 20 years old now. Silver age superman is basically 40 years old. Do you see a correlation there?
I don't have that many points I wanted to make except to say
that I don't see a problem with a couple villains and a type of supergirl that resembles kara and is kryptonian.
I'm all for a genre or story growing and if dc's idea of growth is killing or adding or changing I generally don't mind. To change in a way I feel is idiotic or makes no sense..ala linda/matrix/proty/angel.
Dc can make me like a tim drake. they can make me like a non-kara supergirl...they just haven't yet.And since she doesn't exist yet..I don't see a problem. Except the adherrant to the lone kryptonian.
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Good Gob, do you people ever sleep?! This thing is already four pages longer than it was last night!
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You are wrong with thinking that the story is 20 years old.
It has been an ever evolving story.
20 years ago Lois & Clark wen't married, so that's new, that's less then a decade old.
I could say that Spider-Man is 40 years old and I'd be wrong since the comic today is not EXACTLY the way it was back then.
Comics are like a Rorschach test; everyone has a different opinion on what they are and can be...
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Ok...Have we beat this topic to death yet?
"I offer you a Vulcan prayer, Mr Suder. May your death bring you the peace you never found in life." - Tuvok.
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Quote:
ManofTheAtom said:
They're told that it ended in the 70's (or 80's, depending on your perspective) and they go on 17 year long rants about how John Byrne killed Superman and there not being super pets in the comics prevent them from having fun reading them.
Then YOU are told the Jurgens era ended in the 90's, and you go on who knows how many years old rants about how Mark Waid killing Superman and how there isn't enough continuity nowadays which prevents you from having any fun.
Why can't you see that you're doing the EXACT SAME THING you despise?!
Quote:
Supergirl merging with Linda.
Superboy and Steel becoming part of the DC Universe.
The Legion being rebooted RIGHT with the JLA instead of an anomaly being their inspiration.
Comics like Ressurection Man and Hitman.
Starman.
Kyle Rayner.
Hal as Parallax.
Wally West and Linda Park getting married.
I OBVIOUSLY meant in the Superman comics! Superboy and Steel came in '93.
Quote:
Lex becoming younger after making a deal with the devil.
Return to the status quo. The fall of Luthor was change and growth. The return was the opposite. The deal with the devil was a half arsed explanation that was barely mentioned ever again.
Quote:
Lex becoming a father.
1 change.
Quote:
Lex getting married
That was undone before the Jurgens era was over.
Quote:
Lex running for President.
After 99, I think. And if it did happen in 99, I mean in the Jurgens era. That's what we were talking about, remember? You said the Jurgens era brought change and growth, and I said not in the last years. Fuck, you're not even paying attention.
Quote:
Lucy having a son.
2 changes. 3 if you add Lana and Ron's relationship.
Quote:
Lana having a son.
4 changes.
Quote:
Lana getting married to Pete.
Happened before the period I'm referring too. Things started getting lame after Action #700.
Quote:
And other stuff you probably don't care about or will debunk for "sucking" 
In other words, nothing else. Four changes. Whoa. If the Jurgens era had continued we'd probably have one more by now, maybe two!!!
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Quote:
ManofTheAtom said:
Quote:
I'm Not Mister Mxypltk said:
Fuck you. I've never said I don't like what Byrne did (I've said the opposite 100 times!), all I'm saying is that it's about time we get something new.
MOTA: "But new isn't the Silv--"
Yeah, yeah, fuck it, whatever. I don't care if it has SA elements or not. All I'm saying is I wouldn't go nuts if there were.
MOTA: "But Birthrigh--"
Lemme finish, damn it! Fuck Birthright. I haven't read it, I can't judge it until I do (sadly, I can't judge stories on their covers, lenght or wether or not they include a superpet, like some people). MoS came along when we needed something new. Now we need something new again.
A lot of people bitched like you're bitching now when MoS came along ("We don't need this..." "Superman is fine like he is..." "Whoever likes MoS is stupid..." "Well, he could use some man-boobs...").
I've never said that Superman is fine like he is right now.
I've said countless times that Superman needs to move away from the bs from the last four years and get back on track.
That has nothing to do with the origin.
Fuck, did you read my post?! You stayed with a line (an example I was giving) and ignored the rest. I know you don't think Superman is right the way he is now: you want him to go back the Jurgens era (the past) instead of moving on to something new (the future).
Now you'll say "The Silver Age isn't the future".
Well, I don't care. I haven't mentioned BR or the Silver Age in my post until now. I said "something new", which means "NOT Man of Steel". It may (and it probably should) take elements from Man of Steel just like Man of Steel took elements from the Golden and the Silver Age, that are still free for reference.
I said you are bitching right now exactly like some fans were bitching in 86, and you just confirmed it.
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Quote:
ManofTheAtom said:
It's very simple Mxy:
Fuck brains like KK don't allow readers like me to enjoy what they don't like, so I see no reason to let them enjoy what they do.
Might be petty but that's how I work, I give as I take.
That's insane. If you think what someone is doing is wrong then you shouldn't do it! You're proving yourself to be an idiot by doing things you yourself consider wrong.
Quote:
Fuck heads like KK try to convince people that Superman was defined in the 60's and that things like Moore's Supreme is the one and only way that Superman should be done (for example, I have many).
And you think that's stupid so in response you do something stupid too: try to convince people that Superman was defined in the 80's and that Byrne's Man of Steel is the only way Superman should be written.
Quote:
Trying to talk with these people with any kind of respect is useless.
You can spend months trying, in the kindess of ways, to make them realize and understand (for example) that their character evolved and changed into what he is now and what you'll get back is insults for liking the character as he was between 86 and 99.
You'll get attack with terms like Byrne victim or told that Superman is a Supermurderer... and reminded that Moore did Superman right with Supreme (can't forget that one) and anyone that doesn't follow that pattern is wrong, as are those that like that different version.
You're not blind, you saw the two previous pages of conversation I had with Beardguy57.
I'm respectful with people that deserve respect, notfuck heads who spend their time telling readers like me that we're wrong for liking something just because it doesnt' follow the fucking mantra of the Silver Age.
So you do practically the same thing: insult people for like something because it doesn't follow the fucking mantra of the Modern Age.
So, all this started when you met KK in the DCMBs? Didn't you say you respected him in the DCMBs? Didn't your rants start before he showed his "true colors"?
And his influence on you is so big that it makes you insult Mark Waid? ("Mark Waid is trying to bring back the Silver Age which I hate, so I must insult him, because KK insulted me")
Nope, that doesn't fit. KK isn't half as close-minded as you are. Trust me, if he talked about the Modern Age and it's fans like you talk about the Silver Age and whoever dares liking it, I'd be having this conversation with KK and not you.
I've never heard KK say that "anyone who reads a Modern Age comic is an idiot because those comics are for idiots".
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devil-lovin' Bat-Man 15000+ posts
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ManofTheAtom said:
For most fuck heads (not that I'm saying you are one, at least not in this reply to this message) think that back on track means MORE Kryptonians, MORE Super pets, Kandor, MORE Kryptonite, dead kents, Luthor in Smallville and all the outdated bullshit Byrne got rid of...
That's what's wrong with you. Let's go to John Byrne's boards and ask him if he thinks that anyone who likes those elements is a fuck head. In fact, let's ask him what he thinks of a person who says something like that.
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These comes from people that can't accept that those elements are gone...
...like MoS...
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Assassinist 500+ posts
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Doc.Mid-Nite said:
It wasn't that Byrne really did anything new with the Superman mythos, he just put his own spin on it. DC decided to reboot everything, not Byrne. DC and Superman's editors decided to take him in a new direction, they just hired Byrne to write it. Superman's editors decided to depower him so that he would have more Golden Age type power levels (only faster than a speeding bullet, only more powerful than a locomotive, but they kept his ability to fly), not Byrne. It was Jack Kirby who introduced Cadamus, The Guardian, and The Newsboy Legion to the Superman mythos (Jimmy Olsen and The Newsboy Legion) during the Silver Age, not Byrne after Crisis. It was Seigel and Shuster who created Superman's sole weakness (green K) and Silver Age writers who created other forms of Kryptonite, so green K being Superman's only weakness is a Golden Age idea, not Byrne's.
Here's another question. When Byrne wrote MoS he chose to use certain pre-Crisis elements. But what makes the elements Byrne chose for MoS better than the elements he didn't?
"Life ain't nothin' but bitches and money" - Ice Cube
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Joined: Dec 2000
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devil-lovin' Bat-Man 15000+ posts
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ManofTheAtom said:
See, that's a bullshit statement.
If it were at all true then you'd be saying "gee, why do we need to alter ONE version to have more variants?
Wouldn't it be better to revive something like Superman Adventures, which offered a different version from Superman?
Add that to the Smallville comic and the regular comic and you have three different versions of the character, all with three different rules (Adventures had MORE Kryptonitans)".
No, instead you expect ONE version to be split into three different ones.
So don't say that you like different versions when the truth is that you want ONE version to be replaced with three others because you don't like that ONE version. (even though you claim you do...)
It's amazing how much you claim to know me. Who the fuck do you think you are?
I, really, honestly, wish that in this three versions thing you get yours. And not just so you shut the fuck up (OI think you'd still bitch if you got exaclty what you're asking for). If this three version thing turns out to be "three versions of one version" (isn't that a contradiction?!) like you think it will, then it will suck.
I wish we get one old Byrne inspired Superman, one older SA inspired Superman, and a new Superman. That's what I want and if you think I'm lying for whatever reason then you really are fucking insane.
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I hope it is, there's still no fucking reason to have three different Supermen existing at the same time other than to please the more assnine of fans that can't let go of the 1960's...
Yeah, pleasing the more "assnine" of fans that can't let go of the 80's and new fans as well.
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NOOOO. What works for the CONCEPT.
You mean HOW YOU INTERPRET THE CONCEPT! Someone else can interpret it differently. Once again, YOU'RE NOT GOD!
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It's one thing to be open to change and nostalgia... it's another when SA fuck heads keep insisting that Byrne killed Superman and that the 60's defined the character and anything that's different from that is wrong, as is everyone that likes it.
You mean, exactly what you're doing now with Waid and the 80's.
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You did read what I said, right? Or was that over your head too?
Try again...
No, I read it, I just have a hard time believing it. You just said you'd accept a new version of Superman different from Man of Steel if there was a Crisis to "support it". That contradicts what you said in another thread about Man of Steel being the one true origin "for ever and ever" (your words).
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I'm saying that those comics are clear as water, for those that AREN'T hypocrates and pretend they're something they're not.
BR brings back elements from the Silver Age and Moore's Supreme was a fucking rip off of Superman.
Anyone with eyes can see that... anyone that doesn't is either blind or in denial...
Or (gasp) is an intelligent person who simply happens disagrees with you. Why must people be fucking idiots if they disagree with you?
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ManofTheAtom said:
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Not at all.. my opinion is that the consistancy of the stories is more important than some losers whinning about Kara Zor-El being dead...
Crisis happened, deal with it.
DC's had plenty of changes to unmake it and they haven't... till now that is.
If they were going to unmake it they could have done a much better job than fucking Superman #200, don't you think?
And fucking Birthright and fucking Godfall and stupid ass three Supermen running around at the same time.
These ideas are something that only an editor that's over his head would come up with...
I'm Not Mister Mxypltk said:
My point is: you want your version of Superman to be the only one, ok. But where does that leave the other fans? Why can only one part have their version?
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ManofTheAtom said:
Ok, after reading P.I.'s last message I've gone through all 10 pages and I owe him and the bastard (it's your nick, don't take it personallty) an apology.
Mxy, as I've thought before about him, can be reasoned with when he wants to, so he gets one too.
King Krypton, though, can burn in hell for all I care...
I hope you three accept it in the spirit it's given.
I just read all ten pages and noticed a tremendous inconsistancy in my behaviour towards you and the only explanation I can think of for it is that things outside this particular conversation have pissed me off and I've used that anger against you when it wasn't merited (specially P.I. and the bastard).
Apology accepted. Too bad I didn't see this before the rest of your posts, though, or I would have disregarded some things.
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I'm Not Mister Mxypltk said:
Apology accepted. Too bad I didn't see this before the rest of your posts, though, or I would have disregarded some things.
Thanks, you 2 PI
Comics are like a Rorschach test; everyone has a different opinion on what they are and can be...
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Beardguy57 said:
I like Lois and Clark ...a Lot!!!
You either hate the Show or ya Loved it.
No middle ground. It was campy. It was Dumb.
It was Cute, and often well written.
Of ALL the Actors who played Superman, Dean
Cain is my favorite. He brought life to the roll.
He even LOOKED kinda like Supes did around 1940 or
so, a Bit.
I liked all the interaction with his parents.
That was done well. And his relationship with
Lois..It was very realistic.
He didn't just go around punching out bad guys.
There was plenty of good Dialogue.
I can't agree with any of this (well, I agree with the "campy and dumb" part; that's the only bit that rings true with me). Cain had none of the personality or power of Collyer, Alyn, Reeves, Reeve, or Daly. He came off as far too much of a lightweight jock, not an authoritative force of nature, and he was not convincing as a man of two worlds blessed/cursed with godlike power. In no way do I think he's worthy of the cape, especially in light of the superior actors who came before and after him. I found a lot of the dialogue to be dopey and unfunny, as if the makers of the show were trying to mock the Superman mythos. (The Adam West Batman was a good-natured spoof that boasted fans of the comics on the staff and in the cast; L&C went out of its way to flip off the mythos.) It was excruciatingly poorly written, with villains so lame that they might as well have been yanked from Wizard's "Mort of the Month" feature. There was no soul to the characters, no heart, no depth, and the plots were stupid and demeaning to the character. If you're going to write about Superman, the stories should be ones that do this iconic character justice and give him something of worth to deal with, not unfunny, stupid crap that makes him look foolish.
I'm well aware that L&C has its supporters, and they're welcome to it. It's their call. Personally, I hate the show with every fiber of my being, and I feel that it's a gross insult to Siegel and Shuster's memory. Then again, the new movie promises to be even worse....
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I'm Not Mister Mxypltk said:
So, all this started when you met KK in the DCMBs? Didn't you say you respected him in the DCMBs? Didn't your rants start before he showed his "true colors"?
We never met on the DC boards. He showed up after I quit the boards during a flame war started by He Who Is. MOTA first encountered me here, well after I was made aware of his reputation as a comic book bigot. Further, MOTA is a badl-faced liar when he claims he "used to respect" me. Even before we butted heads, I saw how hateful and intolerant he was toward those who didn't adhere to his exact viewpoint. He's never respected ANYONE'S opinions, let alone mine.
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And his influence on you is so big that it makes you insult Mark Waid? ("Mark Waid is trying to bring back the Silver Age which I hate, so I must insult him, because KK insulted me")
He was screaming for Waid's head LONG before I ever crossed paths with him. I was just one of the Birthright/Trinity supporters he decided to flame because he wants to brainwash everyone to HIS way of thinking.
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Nope, that doesn't fit. KK isn't half as close-minded as you are. Trust me, if he talked about the Modern Age and it's fans like you talk about the Silver Age and whoever dares liking it, I'd be having this conversation with KK and not you.
I've never heard KK say that "anyone who reads a Modern Age comic is an idiot because those comics are for idiots".
Nor will you hear me say that. There've been some Modern Age comics I've liked. But there's been far more that I HAVEN'T liked, simply because I don't like the way the characters have been handled and/or the dependence on a crushing, stifling "continuity" that forces people to buy books they may not like in order to follow a given story. And as I've said COUNTLESS times, I have no qualms with those who like the Byrne/Jurgens material. My beef is with those sycophantic zealots who shriek and bleat that the Byrne/Jurgens way is the ONLY way to do Superman, and that all other versions/interpretations are inherently evil...in other words, those like MOTA. That, and I don't take kindly to his attitude that Jerry Siegel and Joe Shuster "got Superman all wrong" and that Byrne/Jurgens knew the character better than they did (an attitude he's voiced at least twice at the DC boards). But, since MOTA thinks he can dictate what people can and can't like, he'd rather twist and distort what everyone says into a "you just want the Silver Age borught back" non-argument.
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