Haroldson Jr
Member posted February 09, 2003 12:40 AM

Hey Dave, I know all about Asterix, believe me :) . I probably read an
Asterix or another European classic of the type before I ever touched
anything American.

It's even a tradition for Gen X kids like me to watch Asterix cartoons
broadcated for Christmas everyyear. It's the same cartoons and we've seen
them thousands of time, yet we keep watching year after year, and have our
children floow suit. In particular, there,s two no one I know ever miss,
Asterix and Cleopatra (hilarious Cleopatra acting like the spoiled wife of
julius Ceasar) and The 12 Tasks of Asterix (Asterix goes through a
tournament enacted after the story of Hercules, the story is wild spoof of
society, including the best part, the House that makes people crazy-the
ultimate and best spoof on government and big business bureacracies I've
ever seen anywhere).

Asterix, Tintin and their compatriots,
are regarded as kid's comics in Europe and French Canada.
In Asterix, there are many spoofs of French pol,itical life form the 60s
and other things that only adults can pick up. But the brunt of the
material is intended for kids.
I don't know which version you read, but I get to read all my French
European comics in French, so I always get the exact meaning the autors
intended. There's quite a lot of play on words in Asterix and I'm not sure
if the translations can capture that.
When you go in a book store that carries European comics in Montreal,
you'll notice two or three sections. The first is the classics with
Tintin, Asterix, the Smurfs, Lucky Luke and more.
Another will abe about recent kids' comics. The last section will be the
contemporary stuff created for modern comic book readers like us.
That's why I'm not sure if people here would go for the classics, when
they could read material written for thinking adults.
I feel that directing someone to Tintin and Asterix is like telling a new
comic book reader to get Stan Lee's Boy Ranch or Eisner's the Spirit. It's
good material, but it's not recent and the best highlight of what's
available right now.
If people are willing to try and order modern and classic European stuff
online, I can give you addresses of serious bookstore chains in Montreal
where you'll find material.
You'll be uptodate with everything new coming out of Europe, provide you
can read French :) .
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profh0011
Member posted February 09, 2003 02:49 AM

"That's why I'm not sure if people here would go for the classics, when
they could read material written for thinking adults."

Is that mutually exclusive?

semprini
Member posted February 09, 2003 04:09 AM


quote:

Originally posted by Haroldson Jr:
Asterix, Tintin and their compatriots,
are regarded as kid's comics in Europe and French Canada.
In Asterix, there are many spoofs of French pol,itical life form the 60s
and other things that only adults can pick up. But the brunt of the
material is intended for kids.


Speaking as a European, I can't agree with you in this one. Both Asterix
and Lucky Luke (as well as Tintin) are widely consumed by adults. All
these books are intelligently done, which appeals to readers of every age.
Be careful not to label series with a lack of sex'n'violence, gloom'n'doom
or complex philosophical issues as "childish"... Besides, all these books
are usually printed in oversize editions that are usually too expensive
for kids! If given a choice, most of them would rather pick up a cheap
Digimon or some other... cr*p with their money!

And, especially here in Norway, reprints of American Spandex series are
more likely to be branded as "kids' stuff" than any of the ones mentioned
above. Which is a shame, 'cause I enjoy those too. :)
As for the SMURFS, that's another matter entirely...
------------------


profh0011
Member posted February 09, 2003 04:24 PM

"Speaking as a European, I can't agree with you in this one. Both Asterix
and Lucky Luke (as well as Tintin) are widely consumed by adults. All
these books are intelligently done, which appeals to readers of every
age."
Aw man, I love LUCKY LUKE!!! It reminds me of what a Jay Ward western
might have been like, between the style of the art, the complex plots, and
the horse who talks (well, at least to himself). I discovered this about
10 years ago, and have managed to get my hands on about a half-dozen
volumes. GREAT stuff!

The dismissal of supposedly "kids' stuff" sounds to me suspiciously like
the attitudes of many teenagers I've known, who as they grow from year to
year are insecure and anxious to prove how "grown up" they are by putting
behind them things they enjoyed when they were younger. (My brother did
this on a regular basis about every 2 years-- I'd just begin to get into
what he was, and as soon as he saw me getting into it, he dropped all
interest. whereas in my case, if something was good enough to interest me,
I've tended to NEVER lose interest in it, but see that interest slowly
grow and grow as DECADES go by!)

I recall when I reached my teens discovering to my surprise that, for
example, while some "kiddie shows" on TV no longer held my interest, other
shows I didn't understand as a kid I now "got"-- and a few APPARENTLY
"kiddie shows"-- ROCKY & BULLWINKLE the extreme example-- I realized were
far too sophisticated to be UNDERSTOOD by kids! You could enjoy it when
you were young-- but you had to grow up to really "get" it!

Haroldson Jr
Member posted February 09, 2003 07:17 PM

Like I said, I've been reading Asterix and Lucky Luke since I remember.
Both, and other European classics have tons of adults subtexts and jokes.
When I talk about "adult" comics, I don't mean stories with deep
phychological undertones and sex and violence. I'm talking about the kind
of stories, the average current writer, like say, Geoff Johns would write.
In other words, it's not written with a 60s style, or by someone who
worries aabout the Cold War. It's written by someone who lives in current
times.

But then, perhaps I underestimated the interest some of you would have for
the Euro classics. Having read them over and over again as a youth, seeing
them everywhere, in colouring books, games, live action films and cartoon
series, I tend to go for newer stuff. Those Euro classics also lack
serious modern series. Tintin, Asterix and Lucky Luke's creators are all
dead and stopped releasing new material years ago.
------------------


profh0011
Member posted February 09, 2003 10:54 PM

"Those Euro classics also lack serious modern series. Tintin, Asterix and
Lucky Luke's creators are all dead and stopped releasing new material
years ago."
Oh, IF ONLY Marvel & DC had taken their example...!!!
:)

Hellst0ne
Member posted February 18, 2003 06:35 AM

Without critizicing neither, I'd say that several adventures of "Tintin"
are far more "adult" than anything Geoff Johns has written. "Tintin in
Tibet", is a great example of a complex theme clad in a simple story.
/ola

profh0011
Member posted February 18, 2003 02:35 PM

Favorite TINTIN moments...
Captain Haddock is telling Tintin the story of his ancestor, whose ship
was taken over was pirates. He acts out the story as he talks, which
includes a lot of jumping around, waving swords-- and DRINKING. "So
saying, he raised it to his lips, and down in one gulp-- LIKE THIS!"
(gulp) A mone tlater, he describes how the pirates got "ABOMNIABLY drunk.
Yes, that's the word-- ABOMINABLY!" We see Tintin yanking the glass out of
his hand, as the Captain frantically says, "Hey, wait, I just wanted to
SHOW you..." "That's alright, Captain-- go on with your story!" Tintin
places the glass on the floor, where he terrier Snowy laps up the booze.
"Hey! Now there are TWO glasses!" (Doesn't take much to get a small dog
drunk.)
...and...

After suffering from amnesia, the eccentric (and nearly-deaf) scientist
Professor Calculus comes out of his stupor just in time to hear Capt.
Haddock refer to him as a "goat". In a RAGE that's completely surprising
from such a mind-mannered (and small in stature) person, he rages
violently at the Captain, drags him along through corridors, beats up
armed security guards, steals a jeep, and drives out to the desert, where
he abruptly jams on the brakes and points toward the sky. "LOOK! SEE what
the GOAT has created!!!" You turn the page, and see a full-page spread of
a collossal moon-rocket in all its glory, and if you look real close, in
the bottom corner of the panel is the exact same shot from the previous
panel of the Professor pointing at the rocket.
Some things really stick in yur mind-- even decades later! :)