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S P O I L E R S My favorite issue so far. ![[biiiig grin]](images/icons/grin.gif) Two-Face being Hush in retrospect isn't much of a surprise especially since we've seen Hush with the coin. What's a surprise though is he's now Harvey Dent(really cool) and that he knows Bruce is Batman. Bruce revealing his secret to Selina was great too.....I like how Nightwing danced around the issue of her past never coming out and saying she was a whore. The only thing that would kill this story now for me would be to see some cheap gimmick accident in the end that would scar Harvey once again and make him Two Face again....ala the Animated Series. Two Face becoming Harvey Dent once again reinvents the character and will allow alot of new fresh storylines.......and if that happens we all win. ![[woooOOOOoooo!]](graemlins/smilewoo.gif)
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So Harvey Dent is just One-Face now? How'd that happen?
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My first Batman comic! Yipee! I liked it!
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I'll probably pick this up just to see Lee's Nightwing... Never could stand the Bat, though. Reading Batman for me is like watching Seinfeld ... I always watch for George or Kramer, sometimes Elaine or Newman, but almost never for anything about Jerry.
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I liked this issue. Although I would have rather found out who Hush is at the end ... I liked it. I like Nightwing, I liked the humor, I liked the new Bat Mobile ... it was great. I loved it.
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quote:
Originally posted by matlock:
So Harvey Dent is just One-Face now? How'd that happen?
Lots of Plastic Surgery.....and he's bald now......looks kind of like Luthor. ![[izzat so?]](graemlins/zatso.gif)
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I'm not convinced it's Dent. It just doesn't work. Solicitations for a future issue of Batman later on in Hush says Hush will be someone Batman can't bring himself to fight. I don't think Batman would refuse to fight Dent if he had to. He's done it dozens of times as Two-Face.
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quote:
Originally posted by Darknight613:
I'm not convinced it's Dent. It just doesn't work. Solicitations for a future issue of Batman later on in Hush says Hush will be someone Batman can't bring himself to fight. I don't think Batman would refuse to fight Dent if he had to. He's done it dozens of times as Two-Face.
Batman's never fought him as Dent.....they used to be Best Friends. It'll be like seeing a ghost.
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Yeah but Dent is his friend. Whenever he fights, he fights Two-Face. Batman reasons with Dent. Dent is the good guy.
Hmm. So it was Two-Face all along? I'm not sure if I'm dissapointed or glad. Whatever.
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quote:
Originally posted by PJP:
....they used to be Best Friends.
"What are ...friends for? Ha ha ha ha ha.."
I get it.
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quote:
Originally posted by Darknight613:
I'm not convinced it's Dent. It just doesn't work. Solicitations for a future issue of Batman later on in Hush says Hush will be someone Batman can't bring himself to fight. I don't think Batman would refuse to fight Dent if he had to. He's done it dozens of times as Two-Face.
Before someone starts knocking my theory...
1) There's no reason why some can't get plastic surgery done to make themselves look like Harvey.
2) I don't think the incident with the Joker and Dent was kept private. There could be ways for outsiders to find out.
3) Surely word would leak out if Two-Face had really gone under the knife.
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That's true. Maybe it IS Lex Luthor. Lee seems to draw all men with the same face...
Hey, wasn't Two-Face the big suprise villain in Loeb's OTHER "monumental" story? He got a fetish?
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Dent is Loeb's Bitch. ![[eh?]](images/icons/confused.gif)
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quote:
Originally posted by Darknight613:
quote:
Originally posted by Darknight613:
I'm not convinced it's Dent. It just doesn't work. Solicitations for a future issue of Batman later on in Hush says Hush will be someone Batman can't bring himself to fight. I don't think Batman would refuse to fight Dent if he had to. He's done it dozens of times as Two-Face.
Before someone starts knocking my theory...
1) There's no reason why some can't get plastic surgery done to make themselves look like Harvey.
2) I don't think the incident with the Joker and Dent was kept private. There could be ways for outsiders to find out.
3) Surely word would leak out if Two-Face had really gone under the knife.
1) True someone could do that....but why?
2)Also true....I'm sure it made front page news.....but again why bring it up if it wasn't personal.
3)Not necessarily.....Batman doesn't know everything all the time.
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To what do you refer in #2? Spoilers? I get my subscription in the mail...
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quote:
Originally posted by PJP:
quote:
Originally posted by matlock:
So Harvey Dent is just One-Face now? How'd that happen?
Lots of Plastic Surgery.....and he's bald now......looks kind of like Luthor.
Actually he looks like he did in Dark Knight Returns.
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quote:
Originally posted by Uschi:
Hey, wasn't Two-Face the big suprise villain in Loeb's OTHER "monumental" story? He got a fetish?
He references that actually. Maybe he's gonna try for a connection.
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quote:
Originally posted by Uschi:
To what do you refer in #2? Spoilers? I get my subscription in the mail...
Dent goes to bail Joker out of jail....he's going to be his lawyer. He still has the bandages on when he tells the Joker to come with him. Joker then says I'm not going anywhere with someone with bandages and who I don't know blah blah blah.....so Dent says fair enough and starts to remove the bandages......as he's removing them he says to Joker you knew me even before my accident.......you broke into my house on Christmas and beat me up in front of my wife.
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quote:
Originally posted by PJP:
...as he's removing them he says to Joker you knew me even before my accident.......you broke into my house on Christmas and beat me up in front of my wife.
Did that happen? Or is Loeb making more shit up to make things work <~coughTommycough~>?
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quote:
Originally posted by PJP:
The only thing that would kill this story now for me would be to see some cheap gimmick accident in the end that would scar Harvey once again and make him Two Face again....ala the Animated Series. Two Face becoming Harvey Dent once again reinvents the character and will allow alot of new fresh storylines.......and if that happens we all win.
Actually, the "Harvey gets his face fixed only to lose it again" bit has already been done twice, in "Two-Face Strikes Back" (a Finger/Sprang/Paris classic) and "Two of a Kind" (from Batman: Black & White). It's kind of a tradition.
As for the story, I don't think anything can kill it for me. It was already stillborn out of the gate. This is not Loeb's best Batman work.
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quote:
Originally posted by Uschi:
quote:
Originally posted by PJP:
...as he's removing them he says to Joker you knew me even before my accident.......you broke into my house on Christmas and beat me up in front of my wife.
Did that happen? Or is Loeb making more shit up to make things work <~coughTommycough~>?
I'm pretty sure it happened in Long Halloween...if not that it definitely happened in a Loeb story. ![[nyah hah]](images/icons/tongue.gif)
Hey Uschi did you know that today was National Hamburger Day.
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WELL DENT IS NOT HUSH, and dents face will be messed up again or there is no more two-face, and he is to big of a bad guy to just throw away. and we have not seen hush yet, but hes on his way, i think the real bandaged man will be jason todd and ra's will be the one pulling the strings on this whole affair
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quote:
Originally posted by JASON TODD:
WELL DENT IS NOT HUSH, and dents face will be messed up again or there is no more two-face, and he is to big of a bad guy to just throw away. and we have not seen hush yet, but hes on his way, i think the real bandaged man will be jason todd and ra's will be the one pulling the strings on this whole affair
Could be. It's a very good theory.
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Dent getting smacked up by Joker was in the Long Halloween. My friend borrowed it from me and just read it so I asked him to refresh my memory since its been a while. I like this story ... but Loeb is like ... obsessed with Dent to the point that its almost disgusting! There are other good villians! Not Loebs best, but still good! Great art too! But if I find out Jason Todd gets in on this crap with Ra's, I'm gonna be pissed. And if Dent becomes Face again I'm gonna be pissed ... otherwise its gonna be good!
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What the fuck? Are you serious? Or did you just make this shit up to see how many people would fall for it?! TWO-FACE is no longer TWO-FACE?!?!?! AND he knows Bruce is Batman??! HOW does he know?! Spoil my ass off, please. And... Bruce FUCKING TOLD Selina HIS SECRET?!?!?! Holy Jeebus. What the fuck is Jeph doing to BATMAN?! I can't believe DC just said, "Go at it, do what'cha wanna do." I mean... I LOVED TLH and DV... but these past seven issues of BATMAN have sucked massive cock n' balls, especially for him. What the hell is wrong with comics these days? First Frank Miller, and now Jeph? I guess my official position is in: this entire run sucked. FUCK. Nonoxynol9 quote:
Originally posted by PJP:
S
P
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Two-Face being Hush in retrospect isn't much of a surprise especially since we've seen Hush with the coin. What's a surprise though is he's now Harvey Dent(really cool) and that he knows Bruce is Batman. Bruce revealing his secret to Selina was great too.....I like how Nightwing danced around the issue of her past never coming out and saying she was a whore. The only thing that would kill this story now for me would be to see some cheap gimmick accident in the end that would scar Harvey once again and make him Two Face again....ala the Animated Series. Two Face becoming Harvey Dent once again reinvents the character and will allow alot of new fresh storylines.......and if that happens we all win.
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quote:
Originally posted by Darknight613:
3) Surely word would leak out if Two-Face had really gone under the knife.
These days it would be on The Learning Channel.
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Didn't Bane destroy all of the Lazauras Pits? (In GK) In fact there is an August solicitation for a story about Ra's seeking Bats help in that reguard. The fact that age is catching up and there are no more Lazaurus Pits.
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quote:
Originally posted by Nonoxynol9:
What the fuck? Are you serious? Or did you just make this shit up to see how many people would fall for it?!
TWO-FACE is no longer TWO-FACE?!?!?! AND he knows Bruce is Batman??! HOW does he know?! Spoil my ass off, please.
And... Bruce FUCKING TOLD Selina HIS SECRET?!?!?! Holy Jeebus. What the fuck is Jeph doing to BATMAN?! I can't believe DC just said, "Go at it, do what'cha wanna do."
I mean... I LOVED TLH and DV... but these past seven issues of BATMAN have sucked massive cock n' balls, especially for him. What the hell is wrong with comics these days? First Frank Miller, and now Jeph? I guess my official position is in: this entire run sucked.
FUCK.
Nonoxynol9
quote:
[/QB]
I didn't like the first few issues all that much either.....but I liked this issue. However, like Jason Todd says Dent might not be Hush. Dent knowing Bruce is Batman doesn't make sense there has to be someone else......like Jason Todd.
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I know who Hush is. It's Tommy whatshisname. The 'dead' friend.
At least it would be if this was an Agatha Christie novel...
Juan
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quote:
Originally posted by Nonoxynol9:
TWO-FACE is no longer TWO-FACE?!?!?! AND he knows Bruce is Batman??! HOW does he know?! Spoil my ass off, please.
Bill Messner-Loebs did the same thing in his Batman newspaper run. He had Batman reveal himself to Two-Face in the hopes of redeeming him.
quote:
And... Bruce FUCKING TOLD Selina HIS SECRET?!?!?! Holy Jeebus. What the fuck is Jeph doing to BATMAN?! I can't believe DC just said, "Go at it, do what'cha wanna do."
This happened pre-Crisis, actually. It was grist for some really great stories, like "Never Scratch A Cat." Of course, it was handled a lot better than the disaster Loeb's dished up.
quote:
I mean... I LOVED TLH and DV... but these past seven issues of BATMAN have sucked massive cock n' balls, especially for him. What the hell is wrong with comics these days? First Frank Miller, and now Jeph? I guess my official position is in: this entire run sucked.
Ditto that.
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I don't necessarily think that Dent is Hush, although he does appear to be the guy in the bandages (unless we've got 2 guys like this running around). I can't believe that Jeph would be in so much of a rut that he'd use Dent as the ultimate perp again. Plus remember, Jeph said that we'd be able to figure out who it was too, but not until Batman does. And Batman is still pretty clueless on it.
Also saw no indication that Dent knows Bruce=Batman. Is this based on reading-between-the-lines during the story?
I also get strange vibes that while the face may say "Dent", the personality says "Two Face". That last quote of finishing the job he started "when the law was on my side" just screams that he's still the villain inside.
Good interaction between Batman/Nightwing, some humor here and there (loved Oracle's interruption to let the guys know about the Riddler), and even the Bats we all expect to see (responding to Nightwing's heart-to-heart with a "You're right. It is none of your damn business."). But we know he didn't really mean it, because of his observation that "Dick always spoke to me without fear.....He's earned that right." And because of the best sequence in the issue, where Batman just hangs back, watches Nightwing put down the crew, and his pride in Dick just shines!
My only real complaint with the book is in Selina's response to Batman revealing he's Bruce. The impression is that she's surprised. I just can't believe that someone as sharp as Selina, who has spent time around both Bruce and Bats, would not have some suspicions already (as Nightwing correctly notes during the car ride).
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quote:
Originally posted by King Krypton:
It was grist for some really great stories, like "Never Scratch A Cat."
Got an issue reference for that story?
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Well ... not everyone agree's with you there bub.
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Well, I liked it.
I’ve liked the whole story so far actually.
It feels just like a Jeph Loeb Batman story.
There are enough issues now to read back to back which gives the story a much fuller, darker atmosphere and feel.
And hey, it tastes great too!
No wait, it LOOKS great too.
Coupla things:
I don’t think Dent is Hush.
I smirked at Catwomen’s “surprise” at Bats revealing his identity. The disguise is okay but its not THAT okay…
Hey at $2.25 this book is the best bargain in comics right now, BAR-NONE.
Don’t believe me?
Pick up a Superman comic…
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quote:
Originally posted by Starbatz:
quote:
Originally posted by King Krypton:
It was grist for some really great stories, like "Never Scratch A Cat."
Got an issue reference for that story?
Batman #355, January 1983. It was included in The Greatest Batman Stories Ever Told, VOL. 2. There's also a wonderful Earth-One story dealing with much the same thing, "The Autobiography of Bruce Wayne," collected in VOL. 1 (the issue it originated in is The Brave and the Bold #197).
The early '80s was a great time for Batman. :)
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quote:
Originally posted by King Krypton:
quote:
Originally posted by Starbatz:
quote:
Originally posted by King Krypton:
It was grist for some really great stories, like "Never Scratch A Cat."
Got an issue reference for that story?
Batman #355, January 1983. It was included in The Greatest Batman Stories Ever Told, VOL. 2. There's also a wonderful Earth-One story dealing with much the same thing, "The Autobiography of Bruce Wayne," collected in VOL. 1 (the issue it originated in is The Brave and the Bold #197).
The early '80s was a great time for Batman. :)
I'll have to check that out.
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quote:
Originally posted by Starbatz:
Also saw no indication that Dent knows Bruce=Batman. Is this based on reading-between-the-lines during the story?
I also get strange vibes that while the face may say "Dent", the personality says "Two Face". That last quote of finishing the job he started "when the law was on my side" just screams that he's still the villain inside.
My only real complaint with the book is in Selina's response to Batman revealing he's Bruce. The impression is that she's surprised. I just can't believe that someone as sharp as Selina, who has spent time around both Bruce and Bats, would not have some suspicions already (as Nightwing correctly notes during the car ride).
I think with some of Bats' "smarter" villians (Two-Face, Catty and perhaps even the Joker) have pretty much deduced Bats=Bruce. I don't think tha Selina was all that surprised that it was Bruce as she was that he choose to reveal himself to her. That scene pretty much shocked the fuck out of me - seriously, my initial reaction was, "It's about time," but the more I think about it, the more I'm concerned it was done for shock value and kitty cat is going to be mind wiped or - ugh - "re-villianized" or something stupid like that at the end. I would much prefer that if TPTB decided that she is to be in on the secret that we are allowed to see the long term ramifications of Batman making such a choice. And do the editors not speak to each other? Jesus, what is going on in Hush doesn't even seem to impact Catwoman's own title and vice versa. ![[...rassamnfrackin...]](graemlins/grumble01.gif) My own personal quibble.
I haven't liked Hush all that much but this issue was better than the rest. I tend to agree with you in your assessment of "Dent" being the name that Two-Face now uses. As for him saying "when the law was on my side" - I think that Harvey's interpretation of the law is going to be twisted as to whatever he thinks it should be. Also, as to his face being fixed - everyone seems to say its from surgery, but I think that it has to be that he took a dip in the Lazurus pit. Yeah, sure, they're all gone, but this is a comic book and I'm willing to bet that a "new found" pit was discovered along the way....
I also think that this is a big red herring and that Harvey is not Hush - I don't think it's Jason either - and I really hope that its not Tommy... well, we'll know soon enough I suppose..
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quote:
Originally posted by harleykwin:
I don't think tha Selina was all that surprised that it was Bruce as she was that he choose to reveal himself to her. That scene pretty much shocked the fuck out of me - seriously, my initial reaction was, "It's about time," but the more I think about it, the more I'm concerned it was done for shock value and kitty cat is going to be mind wiped or - ugh - "re-villianized" or something stupid like that at the end.
I worry about that too. This is the sort of thing that retcons are made of. It doesn't help to recall that they were involved pre-Crisis as well,and that that was erased.
[QB/]I would much prefer that if TPTB decided that she is to be in on the secret that we are allowed to see the long term ramifications of Batman making such a choice.
[/QB]
Same here. I think we will see it, but it may be a while.
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quote:
Originally posted by harleykwin:
quote:
Originally posted by Starbatz:
Also saw no indication that Dent knows Bruce=Batman. Is this based on reading-between-the-lines during the story?
I also get strange vibes that while the face may say "Dent", the personality says "Two Face". That last quote of finishing the job he started "when the law was on my side" just screams that he's still the villain inside.
My only real complaint with the book is in Selina's response to Batman revealing he's Bruce. The impression is that she's surprised. I just can't believe that someone as sharp as Selina, who has spent time around both Bruce and Bats, would not have some suspicions already (as Nightwing correctly notes during the car ride).
I think with some of Bats' "smarter" villians (Two-Face, Catty and perhaps even the Joker) have pretty much deduced Bats=Bruce. I don't think tha Selina was all that surprised that it was Bruce as she was that he choose to reveal himself to her. That scene pretty much shocked the fuck out of me - seriously, my initial reaction was, "It's about time," but the more I think about it, the more I'm concerned it was done for shock value and kitty cat is going to be mind wiped or - ugh - "re-villianized" or something stupid like that at the end. I would much prefer that if TPTB decided that she is to be in on the secret that we are allowed to see the long term ramifications of Batman making such a choice. And do the editors not speak to each other? Jesus, what is going on in Hush doesn't even seem to impact Catwoman's own title and vice versa. My own personal quibble.
I haven't liked Hush all that much but this issue was better than the rest. I tend to agree with you in your assessment of "Dent" being the name that Two-Face now uses. As for him saying "when the law was on my side" - I think that Harvey's interpretation of the law is going to be twisted as to whatever he thinks it should be. Also, as to his face being fixed - everyone seems to say its from surgery, but I think that it has to be that he took a dip in the Lazurus pit. Yeah, sure, they're all gone, but this is a comic book and I'm willing to bet that a "new found" pit was discovered along the way....
I also think that this is a big red herring and that Harvey is not Hush - I don't think it's Jason either - and I really hope that its not Tommy... well, we'll know soon enough I suppose..
The more I think about it......you are correct. Dent's not Hush.......Could be they dipped Tommy in the Lazarus Pit after he was shot huh. ![[whaaaa!]](eek01.gif)
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