#22715
2003-10-16 11:21 AM
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.... and I must say that I was greatly dissapointed. There really wasn't too much there to be enjoyed. What I liked about the first one is that I went in totally blind about the story. All I knew was that there were these weird, kick ass FX. The inclusion of a plot was a pleasant addition to it. Reloaded had too much information and scenes floating around for there to be anything extra when you finally saw it. All of the coolest parts of the film were used in the trailers.
I also felt that the film was too overloaded with information, symbolism, and hints at what's to come. That really bogged the movie down and seriously cut into the enjoyment level. The flow of the movie just seemed wrong and didn't keep me interested.
I was really let down by the FX of this film. The whole time, we've been promised the next step beyond Bullet Time and FX that would blow everything else out of the water. Well, where was it. All I really saw was a cut down on the use of the rotating camera in Bullet Time and the slowing down, speeding up, and slowing down of the film constantly. There was very little that was new here.
The first fight scene with Smith on the playground was the best part of the movie. Great action and fighting that should have continued throughout the movie. Few of the other fight scenes were enjoyable. The freeway scene, which everyone raved about, was pretty boring to me. Not much really went on. Morpheaus had some cool things, but it lacked overall.
I think the main thing I didn't like about this movie is that it didn't seem to work as an adequate sequel to the first. This movie seemed too different to really fit into a series. It didn't feel as though it was part of the same overall story. Reloaded feels as much a continuation of it's predecessor as Batman Forever does.
I'm glad someone else bought this DVD and let me see it, because I sure as hell wouldn't have been happy spending the money on it.
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#22716
2003-10-16 12:38 PM
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Nothing really happened except that we got a new question that theoretically made everything that already happened moot, because everything has been for nothing because they're in a box in a box in yet another box.
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#22717
2003-10-16 4:53 PM
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Joined: May 2003
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it's all runaround and fuzzy philosophy. And the orgy scene was beyond gratuitous.
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#22718
2003-10-16 4:56 PM
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Joined: Jun 2002
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Timelord. Drunkard. 15000+ posts
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Yes, it's nice to know that in the distant future when humanity faces its darkest hour and possible obliteration that people still know how to throw a rave.
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#22719
2003-10-16 6:20 PM
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Joined: Oct 2002
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He tastes of America 15000+ posts
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I didn't see no orgies...
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#22720
2003-10-17 5:36 PM
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I think the biggest thing about this movie is that I didn't give a shit about any of the characters. I could care less if they died. Instead of exploring the Messiah status that Neo had with some people, which would have been cool, they wrap it up with him being bummed about it because it keeps him from fucking his girlfriend. If humanity is like that in the future, it deserves machines to fucking erradicate them.
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#22721
2003-10-17 11:06 PM
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 19,546 Likes: 1
living in 1962 15000+ posts
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Dude, humanity's like that now!
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#22722
2003-10-18 1:12 AM
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Joined: May 2003
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I thought the deep amount of philosophy and symblolism made it better than the first. I also liked the smaller use of gun play. I didn't think there was a single bad thing about it.
SMS
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#22723
2003-10-20 11:10 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
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quote:
Originally posted by AX Knight:
I thought the deep amount of philosophy and symblolism made it better than the first. I also liked the smaller use of gun play. I didn't think there was a single bad thing about it.
SMS
Agreed
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#22724
2003-10-20 12:37 PM
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,203
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quote:
Originally posted by AX Knight:
I thought the deep amount of philosophy and symblolism made it better than the first. I also liked the smaller use of gun play. I didn't think there was a single bad thing about it.
SMS
What deep philosophy?
That movie displayed perhaps the most incomplete understanding of metaphysics and epistomology I've ever seen...
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#22725
2003-10-20 12:58 PM
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Not to mention that it took two movies to explain that they are in a program that is yet in another program. Bahhhh. Their epistomology apparently is pistols...
What's epistomology professor Theo?
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#22726
2003-10-20 12:59 PM
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Wait does it have soemthing to do with religion or the apostles or something?
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#22727
2003-10-20 4:36 PM
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You're thinking of Paul's Epistles, or letters, that make up a good chunk of the New Testament.
I think epistomology has something to do with the theory or study of knowledge or something. Definitely associated with philosophy.
As far as philosophy goes in the Matrix Reloaded...
Morpheus' Zion speech sucked. It made absolutely no sense, and certainly would not drive me to orgiastic frenzy upon hearing it.
Neo's conversation with the Councilman also kinda wandered, but I got the hint. Humans need machines. Could there be a way to work things out between the two? Could humans and machines live in harmony?
I think this leads up to Neo's joining forces with the Machine AI to take down Smith in Revolutions.
The Merovingian's big long speech on control was exactly that, long. We get the hint. But I kinda liked seeing that chick's beef curtains explode after eating the chocolate cake.
This could lead up to the revelation that the world is, and has always been, normal. That it's barren and battle-scarred is only an illusion projected by the machines to keep the humans under control. But that's just my thoery, it's not a spoiler or anything.
The only long "philosophical" discussion I enjoyed was Neo's exchanges with The Architect. I liked that. Very well done.
Actually, I think the world isn't scorched or battle-scarred at all. I think the world's actually just as beautiful as it ever was, and fooling the humans into believing the world's actually desolate and uninhabitable may be the easiest way for the Machines to keep the humans contained and controllable. I think, at the end of Revolutions, we're going to find out that the world's still as (and has always been) gorgeous and life-bearing as it is now.
But who knows?
Non
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#22728
2003-10-20 5:18 PM
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Joined: May 2003
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quote:
Originally posted by Pig Iron:
Not to mention that it took two movies to explain that they are in a program that is yet in another program. Bahhhh. Their epistomology apparently is pistols...
What's epistomology professor Theo?
They never said it was a program within a program. All the Architect said was that the problem with the matrix was choice. He wanted to be able to perfect the matrix so everyone would choose to stay inside. That's where the prophecy of "the One" comes in. In fact in the video game when they ask where Neo is the Oracle states he's some place between, "your world and mine."
Remember, at the end of the first Matrix when Neo jumped into Agent Smith, a piece of Neo wrote onto Smith. So who's to say a piece of Smith didn't write onto Neo's program? There's more to this than we know, and I can't wait to see it.
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#22729
2003-10-20 5:26 PM
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I especially liked the scene in the freeway where the SUV flips over on account of Morpheus scratching it's side with his sword.
I also liked the scene in the end of the film where Trinity jumps from one building to the next one and as she discards her bike, it falls on a small building which explodes spectacularly as the bike crashes thru it's roof. That shack must have been the buildings munition locker I guess.
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#22730
2003-10-20 5:30 PM
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Joined: Jun 2002
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Reloaded really does hint that Zion is still in the Matrix. It's just an illusion so that the human minds that are in the 10% minority have something to preoccupy themselves with.
The philosophy is really not very well thought out and just thrown out there. The movie is trying to be too smart and falls well below its own standards. For the most part, Matrix Reloaded is a very pretentious movie. That's why I didn't like it.
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#22731
2003-10-20 5:31 PM
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Joined: Jun 2002
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quote:
Originally posted by whomod:
I also liked the scene in the end of the film where Trinity jumps from one building to the next one and as she discards her bike, it falls on a small building which explodes spectacularly as the bike crashes thru it's roof. That must have been the munitions locker I guess.
It was the fucking guard house. The bike must have struck the microwave or something.
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#22732
2003-10-20 6:12 PM
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Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 14,896
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quote:
Originally posted by theory9:
What deep philosophy?
That movie displayed perhaps the most incomplete understanding of metaphysics and epistomology I've ever seen...
Agreed. There was no deep philosophy. It was probably one of the poorest attempts at psuedo-intellectualism I've ever seen. I thought the last one actually made some interesting points(like about humans being more like a virus than mammals), and had intelligent discourse, whereas this one just faked it with big words and dramatic pauses. The keymaker's boringly cryptic speech pattern was especially dull.
quote:
Originally posted by whomod:
I especially liked the scene in the freeway where the SUV flips over on account of Morpheus scratching it's side with his sword.
That whole highway sequence, while visually spectacular, really got away from what made the first Matrix movie so interesting.
The agents were suppose to be scary.
What happened to the whole "If you see an agent, do what we do....run. Run your ass off." mentality? In the last movie, Morpheus gets his ass handed to him by an agent, but in this movie, against so called "upgrades", mind you, Morpheus kicks the agent's ass. Oh, right....he had a sword.
I worried about this after the last movie, actually. How could they really present a challenge that's believable when Neo is essentially God? It makes the sequels fairly undramatic. Neo can't lose. He's "the one". He can do whatever he wants, at will.
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#22733
2003-10-20 6:15 PM
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Oh, what I also didn't get was how Neo was so convinced that the Architect was right. Didn't the Architect also tell him that Trinity was going to die "and there's nothing (he) could do about it"? That didn't turn out to be right.
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#22734
2003-10-20 6:23 PM
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Joined: May 2003
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Well if the real world is a matrix within the matrix, whats the problem? Why all the nonsense with "the One"? If they're still hooked up, why destroy Zion and start over again? And the Architect talked about the reboot of the system, and that if Neo doesn't reinsert his program Zion will still be destroyed and the matrix will fail.
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#22735
2003-10-21 9:31 AM
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Joined: Jun 2002
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quote:
Originally posted by Stupid Dogg:
Well if the real world is a matrix within the matrix, whats the problem? Why all the nonsense with "the One"? If they're still hooked up, why destroy Zion and start over again? And the Architect talked about the reboot of the system, and that if Neo doesn't reinsert his program Zion will still be destroyed and the matrix will fail.
It gives people hope. They have something to strive for. Basically, it goes back to the first one about people couldn't live in a perfect world and had to have despair and what-not. So the machines give them the fight against the Matrix. But after a couple hundred years, there's just too many of them. So they have to be cleaned out and the process starts all over again.
I have no problem with that. It is a neat concept, but I've seen it presented much better before.
I agree with the comments about the agents. WTF?! These dudes were hardly a threat at all. It really makes the Trinity scene at the end less dramatic. The Twins were a big disappointment. They were such pussies after being played up in the advertising. Can you say Darth Maul, kids? The vampire programs thing was just utterly retarded.
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#22736
2003-10-21 10:31 AM
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Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 16,240
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Bring on Return of The King.
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#22737
2003-10-21 1:00 PM
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My impression of every conversation Neo had with a program in the Matrix.
Program: Why are you here?
Neo: You know why I'm here. Why are you here?
Program: I'm a conveniently placed plot device here to spout off poorly scripted philosophy and give ambiguous hints as to the dramatic plot revelation in the next movie.
Neo: Whoa!
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#22738
2003-10-22 1:17 AM
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Joined: May 2003
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My other major beef with this movie (besides the ones already mentioned) is the fact that the wire work seemed more obvious this time around. Now the point of wires is to acheive the illusion of defying gravity to some extent. This time around, I couldn't help but to notice just how "visible" the wires were. When anyone was airborne, the movements didn't look graceful at all. It looked like they were dangling on a wire and subject to all the physical limitations of being suspended on one. It looked at times like someone with not enough slack and an overzealous choreographer.  "other than that, my day sucked" - from The Crow
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#22739
2003-10-25 4:23 AM
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 24,106 Likes: 1
faggot 15000+ posts
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quote:
Originally posted by thedoctor:
.... and I must say that I was greatly dissapointed. There really wasn't too much there to be enjoyed. What I liked about the first one is that I went in totally blind about the story. All I knew was that there were these weird, kick ass FX. The inclusion of a plot was a pleasant addition to it. Reloaded had too much information and scenes floating around for there to be anything extra when you finally saw it. All of the coolest parts of the film were used in the trailers.
I also felt that the film was too overloaded with information, symbolism, and hints at what's to come. That really bogged the movie down and seriously cut into the enjoyment level. The flow of the movie just seemed wrong and didn't keep me interested.
I was really let down by the FX of this film. The whole time, we've been promised the next step beyond Bullet Time and FX that would blow everything else out of the water. Well, where was it. All I really saw was a cut down on the use of the rotating camera in Bullet Time and the slowing down, speeding up, and slowing down of the film constantly. There was very little that was new here.
The first fight scene with Smith on the playground was the best part of the movie. Great action and fighting that should have continued throughout the movie. Few of the other fight scenes were enjoyable. The freeway scene, which everyone raved about, was pretty boring to me. Not much really went on. Morpheaus had some cool things, but it lacked overall.
I think the main thing I didn't like about this movie is that it didn't seem to work as an adequate sequel to the first. This movie seemed too different to really fit into a series. It didn't feel as though it was part of the same overall story. Reloaded feels as much a continuation of it's predecessor as Batman Forever does.
I'm glad someone else bought this DVD and let me see it, because I sure as hell wouldn't have been happy spending the money on it.
I agree. Just saw it the other day. Seemed to me that all the plot advancement was spoken with action bits dividing the repetition of "you don't GET it, Neo." phrases.
It sucked.
Especially that queer party in Zion. WTF? Dance party? ![[no no no]](graemlins/nono.gif)
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#22740
2003-10-25 1:15 PM
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Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 14,896
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Yeah, the dance thing made no sense.
"The end of the world's coming!"
".......let's dance!"
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#22741
2003-10-25 1:16 PM
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Joined: Oct 2001
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.....put on your red shoes and dance the blues....
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#22742
2003-10-25 1:39 PM
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Joined: Mar 2002
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glad i only rented this, as i fast forwarded through the rave thing. i'd have been pissed if i had bought this.
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#22743
2003-10-26 3:22 AM
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Joined: Mar 2003
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One of my sisters bought it and I borrowed it over the weekend.
I hope to god that the whole Zion bit IS a part of the program. 'Cause if they decide that people are allowed to have superpowers, somebody is going to die.
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