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The Eurostar said:
Pro, about the order:

I had great expectations after you put that post(s) about Turkish, Friday and Z in issue 0 and that short solo at the starting of the HR Universe. At that time, the Universe was shaping up like something very sci fi, hidden agends, secret societies and invading alien. A cross of X files and Twin Peaks, so to speak, mostly thaks to the stuff Chewy, Gooz and myself were putting out. I though the Order was something along those lines.

Then, when you put Turkish in the group, I began toi loose my expectation. He was an omnipotent guy, able to ask nature anything (I know you disagree on this, but, let's face it, you know his weakness, me not).
And when Legends came, I found that there was a lot of Turkish types. Each of them very cool, each of them, though, very powerful. The kind of powerful that has me saying, why they live in their secluded paradise instead of coming on Earth and solve the problems of humankind?

I know the answer, they let humankind solve their problems by their own, and whatch their back only from cosmic menaces.

But that means that any story with them has to be cosmic, and cosmic storyes, FOR ME, are good just once in awhile, like issue 14. Noiw we need a lot of down to Earth stories.



Okay. I can understand that. And, I see alot of your points. However, and perhaps it was poor execution on my part, but, I kind of wrote agents like Lady Greystoke and Friday as somewhat "middle-weight" fighters; tough enough to hang on their own, but, beatable given the amount of firepower (i.e. Greystoke having to escape from the Vanguardians near the beginning of H&L, Friday incapacitating Tobias right off, knowing that he was too powerful to let free, etc.) I did this with you in mind when I created them, as I knew that you found Turkish too powerful.

As for avatars (and again, I stress, there is a difference between "Agents" and "Avatars"), I tried writing Rowena and Graham with more passive abilities (Graham's limitation while in Haven, Rowena always being protected by 'Death', etc., etc.). Cross is clinically insane, and easily beatable. Z? Z is just transport, really. Yeah, I've shown her using her abilities offensively at times. But, I've also tried to show the fatigue that follows.

And, well, the Avatar of Death (whether Wun or Grimm) is exactly that: Death. They, in my mind, are the most powerful of all the avatars.

As for Turkish, I guess it kind of saddens me that no one has ever actually "gotten him" yet (save Grimm and Doc, but, I've spent countless hours boring their socks off with details, so there). But, I also understand that it is probably my own fault. I've always felt that Turkish is only as powerful as Lei-Mu Bai (Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon) or, a Jedi Knight. And, I thought that the limits are understood. I mean, Smith beat his ass....twice. But, I guess I simply don't have the ability to communicate that in the writings.

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My vision, is that powerful allies like the Orders, in a sense, detract the role of Vanguard. The EPS, the Pantheon, the Strikeforce, are mixed bag, they can be ally and opponents, the Order, as it is now, would be always "good guys".



You know, I had never had any intention of "detracting" from the Vanguard universe. Seriously. I really thought I was just adding something unique to it. I guess when I first started thinking about working them into this universe, I saw a lack of power on certain levels. Save the character of Mxy, there was just no logical way Vanguard (the MBL at the time) could have given any protection whatsoever from "cosmic threats". Still can't. I couldn't conceive of how they could protect the Earth with so many "hand-to-hand-ers" (my term for all the 'gunsmiths' and down-to-earth types, as in Dirk Bell, Phil Smith, Raptor, Kristogar Velo, Kristofer Chance, Danny Hearn, etc., etc.) Thus, I thought The Order would actually help broaden this new universe. I mean, is it any different than "Continuity" in the TOMBLverse?

Maybe it is. Either way, my bad.

However, I disagree with using the Pantheon as an example. Those guys are just as powerful, if not more powerful than The Order. The Order serve gods. The Pantheon are gods.

And, I mean, Mxy has always been a member/ally of the good guys. Is this any different?

Maybe it is. If so, my bad.

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Probably the only story I would be interested to tell with the Order is when they step out of their track, and vanguard has to stop them.



Heh. I'll try not to take that personally....

But, in all logic, the only way Vanguard could ever even hope to take The Order down, is to stock up on a whole lot of Grimm, Mxy, Tobias, Ameristar, and Sam. Otherwise, the obvious reasons for creating The Order come into play, and Vanguard wouldn't have a shot.

No. I take that back. With sufficient planning, and, logically-crafted imagination from the writers, Vanguard could take them down.

But, really, it's all a moot point. Comforming to this new guideline means that The Order will be in solo threads from now on, and those who do not wish to read them won't have to. And, in the end, I'll probably just move them out of the universe. That way, I won't be detracting from Vanguard.

As always, I appreciate your input Euro. I can always count on you speaking your mind. And, I thank you for it.