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ManofTheAtom said:Who says it was in the solicitation? That was my explanation for it based on the ending.



I said "the solicitation or whatever" to prevent that kind of response. The point is, that's how you saw it.

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Birthright can still be told without connecting it to continuity, yet both the editor and the writer WANT to connect it to continuity.



I see now that that's kind of the whole point of the story, isn't it? A new origin story for a new comic era.

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See, the problem isn't whether or not such stories can be told, the problem is when the writer wants that story to be the ONLY story, which is what's happening with BR.



A) Selective continuity means it's NOT the only story. If a writer has the interest to use the MoS origin as basis for a Superman story he's free to do so.
Don't most people want their story to be in continuity? Didn't Byrne want the same thing? Wasn't MoS the "only" story before Birthright from your perspective? What's the difference now? That you don't like it? That's not significant enough to make a difference.

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This is not a good thing, Mxy.

Byrne is as wrong on DP as Waid is on Superman.



Good arguments. I'll debate that:
No.

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No, I defend continuity and consistancy based on STORY.

BR has nothing to hang on to replace MoS, just like DP doesn't have anything to hang on to replace Acurdi's run.

MoS had Crisis.

It's all a matter of the solution coming AFTER the problem, not the other way around.



Crisis is something that happened BECAUSE of the need to reboot, not the other way. It's a formality. Crisis rocked because it was a new concept, but when they tried to do it again it resulted in a mediocre story (Zero Hour). I think it's wise to skip a resource like that this time if there's no real interest in writing that story, even if it makes anal retentive continuity fans bang their heads against the wall trying to make meaningless details fit in.

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I don't know much about the DP, I had no idea they had been in Invasion.

You just gave a reason why Byrne's reboot of it doesn't work.

I was going off on what little I knew about them, which is just the existance of the Vertigo series that was followed by the recent one that got canceled.

Being a Vertigo book, I didn't think there be a problem in rebooting.



So, eevn if it's a fucking good story, it shouldn't be told. Wait... it should be told in a sporadic Elseworlds special. And the JLA reference should be deleted. That page should be torn from every copy and burnt. All because they were in Invasion 15 years ago, a little detail not even a continuity freak remembers.

Yeah, that's sane.

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Considering that Waid wrote BR based on the idea that what he's putting down on paper is the absolute definite origin of Superman, I'd say that he's the fanatic, specially when it comes to the outdated SA ideas he's using.



He's AWARE that someone will replace him like he replace Byrne and like Byrne replaced the SA Superman. The whole point of doing a new origin is keeping the character fresh.

About it being influenced on the Silver Age: if you became a writer and in ten years you had to do a Superman origin to replace Birthright, what would you do? Seriously, what would you do?

I seriously doubt you'd come up with something completely new. Being the MoS fanatic you are, you'd go back to MoS and use it as your main influence. Then Birthright fans would say "This is outdated, this is based on something that happened 30 years ago, this is written by a fanboy turned writer..."

Can't you see? It's all about points of view.