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finally!
now the GLMBs will be quiet and peaceful!
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here's the story HAL JORDAN RETURNS IN OCTOBER'S REBIRTHNewsarama has learned that tomorrow’s Wizard #152 will send Hal Jordan fans into fits of glee. The issue contains an article outlining how, in the October-debuting Green Lantern: Rebirth, a five issue miniseries by Geoff Johns and Ethan VanSciver, Hal Jordan will return to the DCU in a costumed form, and with a ring. The current Green Lantern series will end with issue #181 in September. Johns is quoted in the article, saying that the storyline will encompass all facets of the Green Lantern mythos, including John Stewart, Guy Gardner, the Spectre, Alan Scott, and Kyle Rayner, who will, according to Johns, play a major role. And somewhere, members of H.E.A.T. (Hal's Emerald Advancement Team), who have lobbied for the return of Hal Jordan as Green Lantern for eight years are smiling – some for the first time in eight years, when it comes to the franchise. Rumors of Jordan’s return have been circulating throughout comics fandom for years, basically, since Jordan went nutso in the Green Lantern: Emerald Twilight storyline, killed a bunch of Green Lanterns, became Parallax, took an arrow to the chest in Zero Hour, and died saving the solar system by restarting the sun in Final Night. During the Day of Judgment miniseries, Jordan becomes the new human host for the Spectre, who had recently dumped Jim Corrigan (Corrigan, jilted, went to Heaven). Jordan was the Spectre since 1999, traveling the path to redemption. Most recently, however, the Spectre/Jordan relationship has been on the rocks, as seen in JSA #60’s (written by Johns) – “Redemption Lost” which has a badly beaten Spectre/Jordan appearing before members of the JSA, saying that he had lost redemption, signifying, at the very least, that the character was undergoing some serious changes. The rumors of Jordan’s return gained significant traction last year, when new Green Lantern editor Pete Tomasi told fans at a comic convention that they would be very happy in 2004. Last winter, at a book signing for Mythology, Alex Ross told fans, when asked about Hal Jordan returning as Green Lantern, “We won!” Peppered throughout Hal Jordan/Spectre appearances most recently (written by Johns), hints have been liberally dropped that a change was coming for Jordan. The latest hints came through Wizard's own solicitation for its July issue (#154), which read: "Tying into DC's upcoming Rebirth mini-series, Geoff Johns tells us what he thinks about the longstanding Green Lantern debate as we count down why Hal must get the ring back!" The solicitation information was quickly changed on Diamond's website to remove all mention of things Rebirth. DC’s Dan Didio is quoted in the article as saying, "I've always believed that Hal is one of the greatest heroes of the DCU. In my opinion, the path he was taken down in some ways diminished his role and his impact as a hero in the universe. And there’s so many unresolved issues concerning Hal, the Spectre, and the GL Corps itself. So we wanted to rebuilt Hal's character, addressing all the things that occurred in his life that made and unmade the man--and at the same time rebuild the essence of what the Green lanterns stand for.” Didio went on to say that in his eyes, Green Lantern should become the #3 franchise from DC, behind Superman and Batman. The full story is in Wizard #152
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I've said it before and I'll say it again...
I think Hal as the Spectre was a good idea that was just handled badly.
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oh well, its just a book. we all knew this was an eventuality that hadn't happened yet, but now it has so the eventuality has become reality. anyway, I only read the book periodically so whatever. At least they don't have Chuck Austen spear-heading it.
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I'm starting the Parallax Returns Advancement Team.
Who wants to be a PRAT?
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It will be funnier to start Kyle's Emerald Advancement Team... ... in fact, I'm going to go start it right now on Newsarama. 
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Kyle Rayner's Absolute Permanance as Predominant Eternal Ring bearer.
who else wants to be in the KRAPPER?
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or animalman's favorite organization! Fans Against G'Nort Gettting an Orange Toga .......
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I may have mentioned this before, but DC deserves all the shit they got over the last eight years on this.
They forget that every character is SOMEBODY's favorite.
You can kill the hero off (Flash), you can have him retire (Starman), you can ever have him take a break for less than heroic reasons (Iron Man), but yo. But you damn sure shouldn't make him a villain. It's like a slap in the face.
When DC turned Hal into a mass murdering psycho, largely on what seemed like a whim, it told a lot of fans that they'd wasted their loyalty on Hal. They didn't like that. Furthermore, given the age that most of us start(ed) reading comic books, it was a bit of the proverbial "raped my childhood" feeling.
If they had let Hal die a hero the fans would have accepted it. ANd we wouldn't be having this discussion today.
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If they'd done it properly and made him a villain in the mould of Magneto, then things would have been kosher all round.
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Quote:
Rob Kamphausen said: finally!
now the GLMBs will be quiet and peaceful!
Yes, I can imagine the Kyle fans will be shrugging their shoulders and saying, "Oh well. You guys win."
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Quote:
Rob Kamphausen said: finally!
now the GLMBs will be quiet and peaceful!

MisterJLA is RACKing awesome.
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Quote:
Dave said: I'm starting the Parallax Returns Advancement Team.
Who wants to be a PRAT?
Well played, Dave.
Thing is- I can’t spell or type. I spell so badly my spell check doesn’t even know what I was trying to spell. And I have five Eisners HAHAHAHHA!!
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They'd better not just get rid of Kyle, by the way. I like Kyle. Even if he did kill billions of people and not give it a second thought. So do many other people. DC have invested a lot of time and effort in Kyle. Maybe he'll go off into space and Hal will stay on earth, or whatever the hell comic book writers do, but don't just kill him off or something...
The Green Lanterns are a Corps, after all. A franchise. There's four or so of them running around at the moment. One more can't hurt.
Last edited by Danny; 2004-04-28 5:26 AM.
Thing is- I can’t spell or type. I spell so badly my spell check doesn’t even know what I was trying to spell. And I have five Eisners HAHAHAHHA!!
-Brian Michael Bendis
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I would rather have aproper GL Corps personally. with Arisia, Ch'p and Katma Tui back. I suppose Kilowog and some of the others are still around, but I have no clue about the 3 I mentioned..I haven't seen them in years and I know Arisia and Katma Tui are supposedly dead.
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Quote:
Dave said: If they'd done it properly and made him a villain in the mould of Magneto, then things would have been kosher all round.
yessiree
a villain (and an immensely powerful one, at that) with an incredible and stirring motive. something that wouldn't have been a "change of character," which'd understandably piss off fans, but rather an evolution, and a smooth one.
he didn't have to be a murdering psychopath -- he could have simply "seen things differently" than the standard goody two shoes leaguers.
a well written parallax could have been the most appealing character in comics.
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Quote:
the G-man said: I may have mentioned this before, but DC deserves all the shit they got over the last eight years on this.
They forget that every character is SOMEBODY's favorite.
You can kill the hero off (Flash), you can have him retire (Starman), you can ever have him take a break for less than heroic reasons (Iron Man), but yo. But you damn sure shouldn't make him a villain. It's like a slap in the face.
When DC turned Hal into a mass murdering psycho, largely on what seemed like a whim, it told a lot of fans that they'd wasted their loyalty on Hal. They didn't like that. Furthermore, given the age that most of us start(ed) reading comic books, it was a bit of the proverbial "raped my childhood" feeling.
Quote:
Dave said: If they'd done it properly and made him a villain in the mould of Magneto, then things would have been kosher all round.
Or they could have gone the path of Marvel's Captain Marvel. Marvel injected excitement into that boring character by making him a mass murdering psycho, seemingly on a whim. It was well done, though.
What CM is, is what Parallax should have been.
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No, Peter David did all that work with Captain Marvel. And for his troubles of making that character interesting and well written, Joe Quesada has let his own personal grudge allow for the cancelling of one of Marvel's best written books currently being published.
As for Hal, he should have stayed a villain when they turned him. He should have stayed dead when they killed him. They should have never made him the Spectre. But, whatcha gunna do? Johns has been telegraphing this for about a year in his books. Maybe the story will be interesting, though I'm not fond of bringing back old, dead characters.
whomod said: I generally don't like it when people decide to play by the rules against people who don't play by the rules. It tends to put you immediately at a disadvantage and IMO is a sign of true weakness. This is true both in politics and on the internet." Our Friendly Neighborhood Ray-man said: "no, the doctor's right. besides, he has seniority."
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With Hal's return, will they be bringing back his old sparring partners, like Evil Star, Sonar, Dr. Polaris, etc.? Will he tangle with the new rogues like Grayven, Fatality, or Effigy? Will we see new villains, or new versions of old villains? How will Hal react to the reformed Goldface, a major enemy of his, being a union leader and hero in Keystone city? Y'see, my favorite part of comics is the supervillains, and Green Lantern, whoever he is, deserves a decent rogues gallery, worthy opponents to match his power against.
Also, here's a thought. If Hal returns, will the Corps return with him? Does that mean John and Kyle will still be GLs and part of the GLC? I'd personally love to see Hal, John, and Kyle as GLs at the same time. None of them deserve to be swept aside just to have one GL. It also might make the book more interesting having multiple lanterns, and taking turns putting them in the spotlight.
"Well when I talk to people I don't have to worry about spelling." - wannabuyamonkey
"If Schumacher’s last effort was the final nail in the coffin then Year One would’ve been the crazy guy who stormed the graveyard, dug up the coffin and put a bullet through the franchise’s corpse just to make sure." -- From a review of Darren Aronofsky & Frank Miller's "Batman: Year One" script
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Quote:
Danny said: Even if he did kill billions of people and not give it a second thought.
When did he do that?
Racks be to MisterJLA
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Quote:
Rob Kamphausen said:
Quote:
Dave said: If they'd done it properly and made him a villain in the mould of Magneto, then things would have been kosher all round.
yessiree
a villain (and an immensely powerful one, at that) with an incredible and stirring motive. something that wouldn't have been a "change of character," which'd understandably piss off fans, but rather an evolution, and a smooth one.
he didn't have to be a murdering psychopath -- he could have simply "seen things differently" than the standard goody two shoes leaguers.
a well written parallax could have been the most appealing character in comics.
I agree entirely. Hal could easily have decided to go down a different path. Thrown in his league membership, started adopting a hard line on evildoers.
What if Hal decided that he needed to take preemptive action against world-threatening foes like Despero, Starro, or Krona and killed one or more of them? Superman is in a moral quandry - he executed the pocket universe Kryptonians. Wonder Woman perhaps can see what he is doing makes some sense. Everyone else in the League is appalled.
Hal takes it further - he starts killing more big ticket villains (there are dozens of these powerful villains in the pages of Superman and Firestorm - Lady Lunar, Neutron, Black Bison, Tokamak). The League decides to stop him from going after Darkseid, and Hal considers the League to be an impediment to the galaxy's safety.
Hal is now effectively a villain. Some people love him for his efforts to protect the galaxy, others hate him for his killing spree. It wouldn't have been hard to do something like this.
As for the return of the GL Corps, Piggo, I agree with that too, although I'd like to see more DC regulars like Tigorr and Adam Strange be given rings.
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Quote:
I agree entirely. Hal could easily have decided to go down a different path. Thrown in his league membership, started adopting a hard line on evildoers.
That's an interesting point. And it COULD have worked.
After all, it silver age continuity at least, Hal was an ex-military man. An ace pilot. There's no reason not to think he killed a lot of guys in combat and would think killing for "the right reasons" was justified.
Unfortunately, DC sort of did it already with the other GL, Guy Gardner.
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guy was a punk with a weird haircut who, for my money, is the comic book identity of our own bsams.
hal, on the other hand, as you said, was militarily trained; saw combat. then, was sought after and drafted by the police force of the universe -- the body of justice that serves every planet in existance wanted him
from hal's view, he's serving the greater good, with the universe as support.
for nearly a decade (his time), he fruitlessly attempted to re-actively prevent bad guys from murdering millions, only to see them return months, even days, later.
its easy to imagine that wearing down on him; his temples graying, as his mortal life saw immortal challenges.
finally, in a 'last straw' scenario, his home city, his family, his friends, and everyone "hal jordan" knew and loved were destroyed. in a single blink of an eye.
wonder woman wasn't there. flash didn't rescue anyone.
it was hal that all the innocents screamed for in their final breaths.
thats a motive no one could deny him.
being reduced to his most powerful, internal element, his will power, he manages the strength and strive to fight back. to utilize the memory of the fallen city to steel his resolve.
this could not be repeated. ever. and the ciminals who caused the destruction must pay for their crimes. thats his job. his will see to that.
no evil shall escape his sight, indeed.
seeing the need, he strengthens his adopted power. evil isn't wary of his power. but using the might of several rings, he'll ensure that those who worship evil's might will beware his power -- green lantern's light!
with swift and emotional action, the crime is paid for, and those responsible are held accountable by the universally-selected judge: hal.
its now his goal to take things further, to make certain the devastation never repeats.
growing more and more anxious over hal's new direction, the justice league is called to action.
but who are they? where were they when hal's city needed them? how dare the likes of superman and batman question his thinking?
were they so morally superior, they'd be wearing the most powerful weapon in the universe.
but hal was chosen. not them.
its his will, his persona, and his character that was selected as the chosen defender of the planet.
he's just seeing that request through.
and there's yer parallax.
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My prediction for the GL titles: Didio says he wants to make it a franchise, so we'll probably get one.
I'm betting Hal stays in space and restarts the GLC (written by Geoff with Pacheco art), and Kyle gets GL proper on Earth with Grant Morrison writing.
THAT WOULD BE ACES.
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Len Wein and Joe Staton did a mini-series where at the end Hal was offered to become the official trainer of the GLC. I'm betting he goes one better and is offered to become a Guardian and accepts. He stays on Oa since everyone on Earth thinks he's dead and rebuilds the Corps from there. But John Stewart, Kyle Rayner, Guy Gardner all are founding members of the new GLC with Alan as the trainer.
Personally, I really don't like having so many characters with the same abilities. Especially ones where they all have the most powerful weapon in the universe. By all accounts, no evil should EVER escape their sight in that case. So why can't they get rid of it?
That's why there should be only one.
"You kind of get tired giving the other team credit. At some point you've got to look in the mirror and say 'I sucked.'"
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Quote:
Chant said:
Quote:
Danny said: Even if he did kill billions of people and not give it a second thought.
When did he do that?
Green Lantern: The New Corps. A two issue prestige format mini from a few years ago. I think Chuck Dixon wrote it, but don't quote me on that. Don't have it here with me for immediate reference.
It wasn't very good.
Thing is- I can’t spell or type. I spell so badly my spell check doesn’t even know what I was trying to spell. And I have five Eisners HAHAHAHHA!!
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Quote:
What if Hal decided that he needed to take preemptive action against world-threatening foes like Despero, Starro, or Krona and killed one or more of them? Superman is in a moral quandry - he executed the pocket universe Kryptonians. Wonder Woman perhaps can see what he is doing makes some sense. Everyone else in the League is appalled.
I'll guess that readers like whomod would accuse the writer of being an imperialistic neocon, or some rubbish...
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Fanboy retardation is spelled "HEAT." Someone should pull a Jay and Silent Bob and beat up local religious leaders for this.
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Quote:
jafabian said: Len Wein and Joe Staton did a mini-series where at the end Hal was offered to become the official trainer of the GLC. I'm betting he goes one better and is offered to become a Guardian and accepts. He stays on Oa since everyone on Earth thinks he's dead and rebuilds the Corps from there. But John Stewart, Kyle Rayner, Guy Gardner all are founding members of the new GLC with Alan as the trainer.
Personally, I really don't like having so many characters with the same abilities. Especially ones where they all have the most powerful weapon in the universe. By all accounts, no evil should EVER escape their sight in that case. So why can't they get rid of it?
That's why there should be only one.
The fact that the GLC did have so many powerful members with identical powers always bothered me too, primarily because the focus of superhero writing is in the gimmick of powers and not characterisation.
A decent writer should be able to sort that out. It never hurt EE Doc Smith's Lensmen books.
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I just hope that things go well for all GL fans from here on in. I only hope...
1. DC acknowledges all of GL's fanbase with creative and entertaining character and plot development that adds to our favorite heroes legend's.
2. That all the GL's stay true to what makes each of them unique (Hal the daring "fly by the seat of your pants" rebel, John the "thinking man's" GL, Kyle the youthful creative free spirit, Raker the dark outsider, and Guy the hardcore "bad cop" to their "good cop") Each of them brings something different to the ring that allows them the right to wear it, not just "will-power".
3. That Alan Scott's only connection to the rest of the GL mythos (the Starheart) remains the same.
I just don't think it would be smart to add too much more to his already long history.
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Quote:
MisterJLA said:
I'll guess that readers like whomod would accuse the writer of being an imperialistic neocon, or some rubbish...
I actually came here after reading the thread title (NNNOOOOO!) and was actually agreeing wholeheartedly with Rob's post about Hal being better served as a Magneto type anti-hero/villian.
And then I read your stupid shit.
Get over me already.
Last edited by whomod; 2004-04-30 4:47 AM.
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I'll commend DC for trying something different and taking an established hero and making him a villain for awhile. But originally Hal was killed along with the GLC by decision of the editorialship in order to make GL unique in the DCU. Same with getting rid of Supergirl. It made Superman more unique. I want to know why they're backtracking on their decision after sticking with it for more than ten years.
"You kind of get tired giving the other team credit. At some point you've got to look in the mirror and say 'I sucked.'"
Alex Rodriguez, after the NY Yankees were eliminated from the 2006 ALDS by the Detroit Tigers.
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Quote:
whomod said:
Quote:
MisterJLA said: I'll guess that readers like whomod would accuse the writer of being an imperialistic neocon, or some rubbish...
I actually came here after reading the thread title (NNNOOOOO!) and was actually agreeing wholeheartedly with Rob's post about Hal being better served as a Magneto type anti-hero/villian.
And then I read your stupid shit. 
Get over me already.
Hal didn't really go psychotic, he just had a bad day. I blame the inaccurate representations in the liberal media.
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Quote:
thedoctor said:
No, Peter David did all that work with Captain Marvel. And for his troubles of making that character interesting and well written, Joe Quesada has let his own personal grudge allow for the cancelling of one of Marvel's best written books currently being published.
As for Hal, he should have stayed a villain when they turned him. He should have stayed dead when they killed him. They should have never made him the Spectre. But, whatcha gunna do? Johns has been telegraphing this for about a year in his books. Maybe the story will be interesting, though I'm not fond of bringing back old, dead characters.
i stand corrected. you're right, it's peter david who should be commended for his work on captain marvel, not marvel comics itself. in contrasting the two comic book companies, i misspoke. my bad.
my point still remains the same, though. what was done with marvel's captain marvel is what should have been done with dc's hal jordan, green lantern. cm went from being a nearly-forgotten hero to being one of the most interesting super-powered characters in a long time. hal deserved the same treatment, and could have had it if the character's conversion to villainhood had been written similarly.
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Joined: Sep 2001
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"Hey this is PCG342's bro..." 15000+ posts
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"Hey this is PCG342's bro..." 15000+ posts
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Quote:
whomod said:
Quote:
MisterJLA said: I'll guess that readers like whomod would accuse the writer of being an imperialistic neocon, or some rubbish...
I actually came here after reading the thread title (NNNOOOOO!) and was actually agreeing wholeheartedly with Rob's post about Hal being better served as a Magneto type anti-hero/villian.
And then I read your stupid shit. 
Get over me already.
I win again!

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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 785
Assassinist 500+ posts
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Assassinist 500+ posts
Joined: Jun 2003
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Actually, after re-reading the Newsarama site. I've come up with a few theories on the events that might occur leading into Hal Jordan's ""Rebirth" I'll keep this short and sweet (by putting my theories in point form).
1. Something of cosmicly epic proportions (something tearing into the very fabric of the universe or somebitch...) happens (most likely involving some sort of cosmic entity (maybe Krona) and Hal in some way), and it draws out Ganthet and Kyle.
2. Kyle loses his ring/or it gets destroyed (possibly releasing all of its cosmic energy) and him and Ganthet barely make it out with their lives. Kyle then disappears a short time later.
3. John Stewart takes over the role of "lone GL" for a short time.
4. Ganthet turns to Alan Scott, (because as a Guardian, he knows Alan Scott's ring is probably the most powerful one after Kyle's) to handle the crisis.
5. Alan Scott meets defeat, and searches for Kyle (on his last legs).
6. Ganthet calls on Raker and John Stewart to help him recruit others to handle this crisis (by forming a new GLC)
7. Alan Scott finds a down-trotten Kyle, and convinces him to take his ring (as Alan is too weak to head back into combat)
8. Stewart and Raker, along with the newly formed GLC, head into battle against the cosmic entity (a battle so epic, that Star Wars would look like a square dance)
9. The cosmic entity starts handing it to the GLC, but right when he thinks he has them defeated, Kyle Rayner (with Alan Scott's ring) shows up for the rematch.
10. The rematch commences, and they go toe to toe in another epic. The cosmic entity, having such a hard time with Kyle, uses all of his cosmic energy to try and defeat him, but because of the amount of energy being used on both sides, something amazing happens...
11. Enter Hal Jordan - "Rebirth"
I think Kyle's "major role" could go down like this. And Kyle taking over for Alan makes a lot more sense than Kyle becoming a Corpsman. Just as long as Alan retires and isn't killed I'm fine with that. A retired Alan would make a great supporting character/mentor to Kyle (and Jade), IMO.
Last edited by Doc.Mid-Nite; 2004-04-30 10:43 PM.
"Life ain't nothin' but bitches and money" - Ice Cube
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 53,734 Likes: 2
Educator to comprehension impaired (JLA, that is you) 50000+ posts
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Educator to comprehension impaired (JLA, that is you) 50000+ posts
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 53,734 Likes: 2 |
Quote:
MisterJLA said:
Quote:
whomod said:
Quote:
MisterJLA said: I'll guess that readers like whomod would accuse the writer of being an imperialistic neocon, or some rubbish...
I actually came here after reading the thread title (NNNOOOOO!) and was actually agreeing wholeheartedly with Rob's post about Hal being better served as a Magneto type anti-hero/villian.
And then I read your stupid shit. 
Get over me already.
I win again!
RACK JLA!
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Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 33,920
devil-lovin' Bat-Man 15000+ posts
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devil-lovin' Bat-Man 15000+ posts
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 33,920 |
Quote:
Doc.Mid-Nite said: Actually, after re-reading the Newsarama site. I've come up with a few theories on the events that might occur leading into Hal Jordan's ""Rebirth" I'll keep this short and sweet (by putting my theories in point form).
1. Something of cosmicly epic proportions (something tearing into the very fabric of the universe or somebitch...) happens (most likely involving some sort of cosmic entity (maybe Krona) and Hal in some way), and it draws out Ganthet and Kyle.
2. Kyle loses his ring/or it gets destroyed (possibly releasing all of its cosmic energy) and him and Ganthet barely make it out with their lives. Kyle then disappears a short time later.
3. John Stewart takes over the role of "lone GL" for a short time.
4. Ganthet turns to Alan Scott, (because as a Guardian, he knows Alan Scott's ring is probably the most powerful one after Kyle's) to handle the crisis.
5. Alan Scott meets defeat, and searches for Kyle (on his last legs).
6. Ganthet calls on Raker and John Stewart to help him recruit others to handle this crisis (by forming a new GLC)
7. Alan Scott finds a down-trotten Kyle, and convinces him to take his ring (as Alan is too weak to head back into combat)
8. Stewart and Raker, along with the newly formed GLC, head into battle against the cosmic entity (a battle so epic, that Star Wars would look like a square dance)
9. The cosmic entity starts handing it to the GLC, but right when he thinks he has them defeated, Kyle Rayner (with Alan Scott's ring) shows up for the rematch.
10. The rematch commences, and they go toe to toe in another epic. The cosmic entity, having such a hard time with Kyle, uses all of his cosmic energy to try and defeat him, but because of the amount of energy being used on both sides, something amazing happens...
11. Enter Hal Jordan - "Rebirth"
I think Kyle's "major role" could go down like this. And Kyle taking over for Alan makes a lot more sense than Kyle becoming a Corpsman. Just as long as Alan retires and isn't killed I'm fine with that. A retired Alan would make a great supporting character/mentor to Kyle (and Jade), IMO.
That's a cool theory. And if there's one thing about cool theories I'm certain of is that they never come true. Which is why Theo will never be a real boy.
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 53,734 Likes: 2
Educator to comprehension impaired (JLA, that is you) 50000+ posts
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Educator to comprehension impaired (JLA, that is you) 50000+ posts
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 53,734 Likes: 2 |
what about my theory about the germans loving david hasslehoff?
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