RKMBs Forums .::Important::. Politics and Current Events Abramoff sings the GOP blues

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wannabuyamonkey said:
Serious question. Set asside the legal or moral implications of this scandal (I'm not dismissing or affirming either) Do you think this scandal has any wings politically? If so, why?

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Matter-eater Man said:I've also acknowledged that ...there [could] be a Dem connected directly to Abramoff. I think the later is unlikely though

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E-Mail Notes Say Lobbyist Met President Many Times
By PHILIP SHENON

WASHINGTON, Feb. 9 — The disgraced lobbyist Jack Abramoff told a magazine editor in recent days that he had met with President Bush many times and was invited to the president's Texas ranch for a gathering of campaign contributors in 2003, the editor said Thursday.

The journalist, Kim Eisler, national editor of Washingtonian magazine, said in an interview that he had received the information in e-mail messages from Mr. Abramoff, a major Republican fund-raiser who pleaded guilty last month to conspiring to bribe public officials. The messages suggest an effort by Mr. Abramoff to cast doubt on Mr. Bush's insistence that he does not recall the two of them meeting and that whatever contact they might have had was fleeting and for the purposes of a handshake and a picture.

In one message, Mr. Abramoff is reported as saying that Mr. Bush had "one of the best memories of any politician I have ever met" and that he "saw me in almost a dozen settings and joked with me about a bunch of things, including details of my kids." It added: "Perhaps he has forgotten everything. Who knows."

An Abramoff defense spokesman, Andrew Blum, said he could not comment on the e-mail messages or confirm their authenticity.

Mr. Eisler said he had been in contact with Mr. Abramoff since interviewing him six years ago for research for a book Mr. Eisler was writing about Indian reservation gambling; Mr. Abramoff's most lucrative lobbying clients were Indian casinos.

Parts of the messages became public this week, Mr. Eisler said, after he shared them with a writer for a political Web site, thinkprogress .org, without realizing that the Web site would make them public. The portions of e-mail messages posted on the site do not provide details of any meetings between Mr. Bush and Mr. Abramoff and do not refer to the substance of any conversations between them except for pleasantries about their families.

"I considered them confidential e-mails, and it was a slip on my part to release a portion of them," Mr. Eisler said.

The White House has tried to distance itself from Mr. Abramoff, and at a news conference last month, Mr. Bush said that while he might have had photographs taken with the lobbyist, "I don't know him." He added, "I frankly don't even remember having my picture taken with the guy."

The White House spokesman, Scott McClellan, was asked about Mr. Abramoff's e-mail messages on Thursday and said, "I think what the president says still stands: Mr. Abramoff is someone who was involved in wrongdoing, he has acknowledged that himself."

According to the messages, Mr. Abramoff wrote that he was invited to Mr. Bush's ranch in Crawford, Tex., in 2003 for a gathering of fund-raisers but was unable to attend because he does not travel on the Jewish Sabbath.

"I would have had to travel on Saturday (Shabbos)," he wrote. "Yes, I was invited, during the 2004 campaign. It was Saturday Aug. 9, 2003 at the ranch in Crawford."

Mr. Abramoff wrote that Mr. Bush "has one of the best memories of any politician I have ever met" and that his memory was one of Mr. Bush's "trademarks, though of course he can't recall that he has a great memory!"

Mr. Eisler said that Mr. Abramoff had told him details of the conversations between the lobbyist and his wife and Mr. Bush and Laura Bush, including discussions of the fact that both couples had twins.

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Matter-eater Man said:
Agreed, the pictures of Bush with Abramoff & his kids will probably be a bit more damaging.

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the G-man said:

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Matter-eater Man said:
Agreed, the pictures of Bush with Abramoff & his kids will probably be a bit more damaging.

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But only because the liberal media will abscribe more significance to such a picture than actually exists.

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Time magazine published a photograph that showed Jack Abramoff in a scene with President Bush. This photo is not one of the five photos referred to in the February Washingtonian story that revealed the existence of pictures of the two men together. One of the photos referred to in the Washingtonian story was taken at the same event as the photo published by Time; in it the President and Abramoff are shaking hands. The Time photo showed Abramoff in the background.

In January Washingtonian national editor Kim Eisler was allowed to see the photos he reported on, but Abramoff would not release them for publication. Several of the pictures had hung prominently in Abramoff’s office and had been seen by many visitors, including Eisler, who first met Abramoff while working on a book, Revenge of the Pequots, about Native American casinos.

When newspapers reported that the White House was in a “desperate frenzy” to find photographs of Abramoff and Bush together, Eisler described in his February Washingtonian Power Players column the ones he had seen.

Before publishing the item, Eisler contacted Abramoff to get details about the circumstances in which the photos were taken. The White House has repeatedly claimed that Bush did not know Abramoff and that the pictures must have been taken at a White House holiday party, when the President shakes hands with hundreds of people he doesn’t know. None of the photographs seen by Eisler matched that description.

In various January communications with Eisler, Abramoff confirmed that he and President Bush had met in “almost a dozen settings.” Abramoff said the President had “joked with me about a bunch of things, including details of my kids. Perhaps he has forgotten everything. Who knows.”

In the photograph taken at the same event as the one published by Time, Abramoff said he and the President were discussing working out with weights.

Other photographs included a picture of Bush and Abramoff standing together with “Cheshire cat grins”; pictures of Bush and what Abramoff characterized as the “bearded fatter me”; a picture of Bush chatting with Abramoff’s twin daughters (“Oh, you are twins; I have twins,” Abramoff quoted Bush as saying); a picture of Bush, House speaker Dennis Hastert, and Abramoff’s children; and a picture of Laura Bush with Abramoff’s wife, Pam, and the twin girls, who had led the Pledge of Allegiance at the event (said Abramoff: “Laura went ga-ga over their being twins”).

A frustrated Abramoff, who feels he has been abandoned by many of his conservative friends, added, “They will come up with excuse after excuse as to how and why he did not know me. I could have spent four months alone with him in Bolivia and he would not know me.”

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Abramoff talks to Vanity Fair

Vanity Fair is set to publish a tell-all interview with disgraced lobbyist Jack Abramoff, noting that his plea-bargain sentence can be "substantially reduced" by co-operating with investigators.

The piece makes much of many prominent Republican's denials of having worked with Abramoff. Abramoff reminisces about jokes President Bush, who now claims not to remember him, made about his weight training program. Abramoff also recalls discussing the Bible, opera, and golf with Tom DeLay.

Abramoff also alleges that RNC Chairman Ken Mehlman provided Abramoff political favors--including aiding in the removal of a State Department official.

Abramoff also claims to have funneled $50,000 donated by clients to a charity he set up to pay for a golf trip for himself, Ohio Republican Bob Ney, and former Christian Coalition head Ralph Reed (currently seeking the office of Lt. Governor for the state of Georgia). Reed also once served as Abramoff's projects director.

The article is supported by images of Abramoff with everyone from Ronald Reagan (left, joined by Abramoff and Grover Norquist) to Newt Gingrich, and is prefaced by a two-page spread of the lobbyist golfing with Tom DeLay. The Gingrich photo is signed, "Your friend, Newt Gingrich." "I have more pictures of New than I have of my wife," the fallen lobbyist tells the magazine.
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the G-man said:
Of course he remembers every single person he meets. After all, its not as if a President meets thousands of people per year.

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wannabuyamonkey said:
Yea, if the Dems get a picture of you shaking someone's hand, forget a trial you are screwed. It's amazing how much they can decern from a handshake.

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wannabuyamonkey said: I'm sorry, but I may be partisan, but I'm not a blind partisan. Infact, I'm pretty pissed off at Republicans right now as I may go into detail in another thread, but please don't accuse me of your own inconsistancies.

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wannabuyamonkey said:
Yea, if the Dems get a picture of you shaking someone's hand, forget a trial you are screwed. It's amazing how much they can decern from a handshake.

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wannabuyamonkey said:
Yea, if the Dems get a picture of you shaking someone's hand, forget a trial you are screwed. It's amazing how much they can decern from a handshake.

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Though he thought that he was meeting the soup nazi from Seinfeld.

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wannabuyamonkey said:
Yes, I did start that very thread. I realise to have started a thread like that would definatly point towards me being VERY partisan, but not blindly partisan. The fact of the matter when I posted that thread is that it seemed clear that Ossama DID want people to vote for Kerry. I don't see how you go from that to blind partisanship. I wonder if you even know what I mean when i say "blind partisanship" because to say Ossama wants you to vote for Kerry may exibit strong partisanship, or even radical partisanaship, bu not blind parisanship.

Blind partisanship is to ignore the the same offenses in your own party that you would decry in the other. If I were to excuse a behavior in Bush that I cried out against Clinton, then yes that would be blind partisanship. I gave you examples of blind partisanship. All you've done is demonstrate that I am strongly partisan. Strong enough to state facts that I see that are ridgedly anti left, but you're going to have to do better than that to accuse me of blind partisanship. You'll have to find evidence of me excusing behavior in Republicans that I condemned in Democrats.

And yes.... Ossama wanted us to vote for Kerry and is probobly unhappy that we didn't.

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Interior Secretary resigns; Ties to Abramoff Indian deals

Interior Secretary Gale Norton resigned today, the Associated Press has confirmed. Norton, photographed at left with fallen conservative lobbyist Jack Abramoff, was fingered in deals with Native American tribes that Abramoff represented. The photograph at left was released in response to a Freedom of Information Act request.

Abramoff's tribal clients donated $50,000 to a conservative environmental group founded by Norton, hoping to win face time with the Secretary. They eventually did.

Former DeLay deputy chief of staff Tony Rudy helped Abramoff arrange a meeting with Norton, and within months, the lobbyist's clients were making huge contributions to the environmental group Norton started, the Council of Republicans for Environmental Advocacy.

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Abramoff: Will Janitor Jack Sweep the GOP Out of Power in 2006?
by Arianna Huffington
Jack Abramoff is the GOP's worst nightmare: a corrupt insider looking for a reduced sentence. A corrupt bitter insider...

His seething resentment at the way his former friends (or, at least, the former recipients of his largesse) have turned their backs on him oozes off the pages of the April Vanity Fair like pus from an infected wound.
"For a guy," he says, "who did all these evil things that have been so widely reported, it's pretty amazing considering I didn't know anyone. You're really no one in this town unless you haven't met me."

Bartender, another round for me and my fellow leper. Abramoff's heartbreak reminds one of the slutty girl from high school who is crushed when the boys who were more than happy to have her in the back seats of their cars on a Saturday night turn around and shun her in the halls on Monday morning. And she's ready to spill the beans.

"Any important Republican," he says, "who comes out and says they didn't know me is almost certainly lying."

A quick review then of a few of these almost certain liars.

There's Ken Mehlman: "Abramoff," he said, "is someone who we don't know a lot about. We know what we read in the paper." This from a man who, according to Vanity Fair, "exchanged email with Abramoff, did him political favors... had Sabbath dinner at his house, and offered to pick up his tab at Signatures" (Abramoff's restaurant). Man, how desperate to curry favor must you be to treat a guy to a meal at his own place? Did Mehlman try to pay for the Shabbat wine, candles, and yarmulkes, too?

Then there's Newt Gingrich, whose spokesman claimed: "Before [Abramoff's] picture appeared on TV and in the newspapers, Newt wouldn't have know him if he fell across him." Watch your step, Newt, you've just stepped on Abramoff's toes. To hear him tell it, "I have more pictures of [Newt] than I have of my wife." Maybe by this he means the Mrs. is camera shy -- but I doubt it.

And Karl Rove who, a White House spokesman tells Vanity Fair, would describe Abramoff as "a casual acquaintance" -- even though Rove has known Abramoff for decades, hired his administrative assistant, dined multiple times in the lobbyist's restaurant, and was his guest at the NCAA March Madness basketball tournament a few years ago. I have friends I spend less time with. Casual, indeed.

Last but not least, there is the president: "I don't know him," he has flatly stated. But according to Abramoff -- and his photo collection -- they've met a number of times, chatting about family and working out. "What are you benching, buff guy?" Abramoff says Bush once inquired of the man he doesn't know. "[Bush] has one of the best memories of any politician I have ever met," wrote Abramoff in an email. "Perhaps he has forgotten everything. Who knows?"

In the Vanity Fair profile, Abramoff floats the far-fetched idea that he should be sentenced to community service instead of jail. "Let me sweep floors at the reservation," he suggests.

Sure, Jack. Why not just ask the judge to let you put your janitorial skills to use in the White House? That way you can repay your debt to society while the president reacquaints himself with your bulging biceps.

Of course, the janitorial bar has been set pretty high in the Oval Office. "Your desk is so clean, Mr. President," gushed Elizabeth Vargas during their recent interview. "Well," replied the president, "that is what happens when you have desk cleaners everywhere."

Or maybe Abramoff can be given broom duty, tasked with keeping clean the president's beloved Oval Office rug -- y'know, the one he is supposedly "fixated" on; the one that says "'optimistic person.'"

That presidential optimism will be sorely tested if Abramoff's lips continue to loosen as he watches his old chums treat him like Typhoid Mary at a hypochondriacs' convention. The singing would-be janitor could be just the thing that will sweep the GOP out of power in 2006.

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wannabuyamonkey said:
You think Dems will come out of this looking clean?

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the G-man said:
Nope

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...Pelosi Statement on Mollohan Decision to Temporarily Step Aside from Ethics Committee

Washington, D.C. – House Democratic Leader Nancy Pelosi released the following statement today on Congressman Alan Mollohan's decision to temporarily step aside as ranking member of the Ethics Committee. Mollohan's letter follows Pelosi's statement:

"Today I have accepted, at his request, the decision of Congressman Alan Mollohan to step aside temporarily as the ranking member of the Committee on Standards of Official Conduct. Congressman Howard Berman, who previously served as the senior member of the Ethics Committee, has agreed to accept my appointment to return temporarily as ranking member.

"Congressman Mollohan has served his constituents of the 1st district of West Virginia with great distinction for nearly 24 years, and I am confident he will continue to do so. He has also provided steadfast leadership to the Ethics Committee during a period of Republican interference and inaction. I have the highest regard for Mr. Mollohan's service to the Congress, to his constituents, and to the Ethics Committee, and I look forward to his return to the committee.

"The allegations against Congressman Mollohan originate from the National Legal and Policy Center, which engages in highly partisan attacks on Democrats. These attacks are an attempt to deflect attention from the long list of Republican criminal investigations, indictments, plea agreements¸ and resignations that have resulted from the reported long-term and extensive criminal enterprise run out of House Republican leadership offices. The Republican culture of corruption has been ignored by the Ethics Committee for a year and a half following the decision of the Republican leadership to fire their own chairman and some Committee members for doing their job.

"Despite the source of these accusations, Mr. Mollohan today has made an honorable decision to step aside so that he can address the charges, and I commend him for his leadership.

"Congressman Berman has an excellent understanding of the Committee's responsibilities and is highly regarded for his non-partisan and judicious leadership. As his record on the Committee demonstrates, Mr. Berman is fully committed to an effective Ethics Committee that holds all Members of Congress to the highest ethical standards."

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wannabuyamonkey said:
Your thread title change is very funny to me. I wonder what the rest of this thread is about?

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Matter-eater Man said:
I didn't see anything funny about G-man's title thread change.

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To summarize what his post was about, I think he was attempting to deflect some of the Abramoff scandal onto the Dem party.

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wannabuyamonkey said:
You don't get it

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So in other words, a partisan Republican accuses a Dem

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the G-man said:
You know, sometimes its difficult to decide if you're clueless, a hypocrite or intentionally disingenuous.

WBAM, Wonder Boy, PJP and myself have criticized Republicans a number of times. Despite this, you always accuse us of being "partisans", while never failing to defend your own, no matter what they do.

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