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"New" does not, in essence, equate to "I'm tired of Superman/Clark/Lois angle....let's make him black, gay, and with a new identity where he writes slash fiction..." or something. Lump summing my quotes into absolutes does not, as well, equate to a good counter-point... 
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If you want, and are able, to explain why something new is good, that's cool. More power to you.
You, however, faced with objections from some of us about the kid, fell back on the idea that it was good simply because it was new.
Maybe that isn't how you meant it, but that's how you presented it.
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Quote:
Prometheus said:
"New" does not, in essence, equate to "I'm tired of Superman/Clark/Lois angle....let's make him black, gay,
This is an idea I've been wanting to see done for years now. Kal - El wakes up one day to discover that he is black. He flies to the Fortress of Solitude, finds a crystal and it tells him about how one in every thousand births to caucasian parents produces a black child. Kal - El was born black, but, being the scientist he was, Joe - El plays God with baby Kal- El's genes and changes the baby caucasian.
The change lasts for years....and then, his DNA reverts to it's original pattern.
This would open up the door to many storylines.
He ought to remain hetero, though, as the world is not ready for a gay hero of Superman's magnitude.
I am more concerned that most of the major DC and Marvel heroes are white. Both comic companies need more heroes who are both very powerful and black.
"I offer you a Vulcan prayer, Mr Suder. May your death bring you the peace you never found in life." - Tuvok. 
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That's stupid. Everyone knows that Superman has a machine that can change a white person black and back again.  He could just use it on himself.
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Quote:
the G-man said:
If you want, and are able, to explain why something new is good, that's cool. More power to you.
You, however, faced with objections from some of us about the kid, fell back on the idea that it was good simply because it was new.
Maybe that isn't how you meant it, but that's how you presented it.
I think you're reading an argumenative angle to my words, as opposed to a difference of opinion.
Why is the kid something positive in my book? Very simple. It adds another layer to a tired and repetitive story. I love Superman. Always have. Always will. However, you can only present the same "love triangle/hero/secret ID/origin/Truth, Justice, American Way" angle so many times, and in so many incarnations, before it becomes redundant. Unless you change aspects of it, it can even become stagnant.
If anything needs new life breathed into it, its a sixty-year-old franchise based around the most fantastical...and reportedly...the most unrelatable of all fictional/comic characters. Change his suit? Details, sure. Change the origin? Tweak it. Update it. No problem. But, if the Corporation deems that he must always be with Lois, then, having a child with her would be the next logical step. This does nothing but add to the story possibilities, in my opinion.
As for your opinion that it's somehow unethical or immoral for him to have a child, but not play an active role as the father...well, I disagree. It's the 21st Century, and I think that by adding such a modern component of family life to the stories, you are allowing new angles and fresh commentary to be made on real life.
Contrary to belief, Superman Mythos must expand, progress, and grow. Otherwise, it will simply become irrelevant in an increasingly sophisticated and complex new century.
Does that explain my viewpoint? 
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You know, the funny part is, I am a father. But I don't identify more with a Superman who's one. Maybe because I've seen first hand how much more complicated fatherhood is than any movie, or at least action movie, makes it.
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So my question is, to change the subject back, are fans...comic and otherwise...ready for Superman to be a dad?
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I think it would be interesting to explore Lois and CLark wanting kids in the comic. I just don'tthink Lois is the type of woman that wants kids, she's kind of career centered.
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I don't think Superman is gunna be a fulltime dad. He has his responsibilities to the world and I think he and Lois know that that is why they didn't tell the kid. I think they introduced the kid to include that dynamic to the storyline. As Pro said it takes some of the reptitiveness out of the story.
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Quote:
the G-man said:
That's stupid. Everyone knows that Superman has a machine that can change a white person black and back again.
He could just use it on himself.
It is NOT a stupid idea. ANYONE can step into a machine that makes you black. My way of turning Superman black cannot be reversed.
"I offer you a Vulcan prayer, Mr Suder. May your death bring you the peace you never found in life." - Tuvok.
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Quote:
Prometheus said:
Quote:
the G-man said:
If you want, and are able, to explain why something new is good, that's cool. More power to you.
You, however, faced with objections from some of us about the kid, fell back on the idea that it was good simply because it was new.
Maybe that isn't how you meant it, but that's how you presented it.
I think you're reading an argumenative angle to my words, as opposed to a difference of opinion.
Why is the kid something positive in my book? Very simple. It adds another layer to a tired and repetitive story. I love Superman. Always have. Always will. However, you can only present the same "love triangle/hero/secret ID/origin/Truth, Justice, American Way" angle so many times, and in so many incarnations, before it becomes redundant. Unless you change aspects of it, it can even become stagnant.
If anything needs new life breathed into it, its a sixty-year-old franchise based around the most fantastical...and reportedly...the most unrelatable of all fictional/comic characters. Change his suit? Details, sure. Change the origin? Tweak it. Update it. No problem. But, if the Corporation deems that he must always be with Lois, then, having a child with her would be the next logical step. This does nothing but add to the story possibilities, in my opinion.
As for your opinion that it's somehow unethical or immoral for him to have a child, but not play an active role as the father...well, I disagree. It's the 21st Century, and I think that by adding such a modern component of family life to the stories, you are allowing new angles and fresh commentary to be made on real life.
Contrary to belief, Superman Mythos must expand, progress, and grow. Otherwise, it will simply become irrelevant in an increasingly sophisticated and complex new century.
Does that explain my viewpoint?
I agree with Pro. A super son gives many story possibilities.
Here's just one:
The kid gives his teacher a hotfoot with heat vision and the teacher calls his parents to come to school.
Here's another:
The child is kidnapped and the kid secretly uses his powers and the kidnapper gets fed up and turns himself in.
There are many possibilities in this direction. They are only limited by a writer's imagination.
"I offer you a Vulcan prayer, Mr Suder. May your death bring you the peace you never found in life." - Tuvok.
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Quote:
the G-man said:
You know, the funny part is, I am a father. But I don't identify more with a Superman who's one. Maybe because I've seen first hand how much more complicated fatherhood is than any movie, or at least action movie, makes it.
Or, perhaps, it is because you fall within the more traditional family demographic. Father, mother, child. One roof, one family. Which, in any case, I'm not opposed to for Superman, either. As BSAMS pointed out, though, this is the best possible scenario in which to take this path. You have the child dynamic, as well as keeping the surface of the mythos status-quo. Lois still pines for the man she can never have all to herself. Clark still pines for Lois, but has a responsibility to the world. Now, with a child involved, things just became that much more complicated.
And Jerry, personally, I wouldn't change Superman black, simply because I'm opposed to altering the ethnicity of any pre-established character. Unless you just reboot the entire mythos. Otherwise, it becomes a forced, shoehorned move to seemingly pander to a specific racial demographic...whether you intended that, or not.
Making Superman black would not add anything to him, or his stories, and would simply be an insult to the African-American readership. It would seem they are "inheriting" a second-hand black hero, as opposed to creating an entirely original one for such a case.
I am very much in your corner, though, about there being a need for stronger, more prominent black heroes. John-Henry Irons (Steel) comes to mind. He's an excellent example of how to present a strong, independent black character. His main shortcomings, though, are that he's so closely tied to the Superman mythos. This takes away from some of his originality, in my opinion.
Also, the decision of how to present a black hero would be a difficult one, in and of itself. African-Americans have their own unique racial identity in the world. Do you create a character that's is, by all intents and purposes, a black superhero? Or, do you create a strong, independent, original character that just happens to be black? Both paths have their own stumbling blocks...
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Actually, Pro, I agree with you. Turning Superman black is a dumb idea. I just want to present possibilities. They could turn him black for 5 or 6 issues. That could be fun, and, if done well, downright fascinating.
I would really rather see a black hero introduced who would be as powerful as Superman.
He could be a terrific role model for black kids.
He would present many new possibilities.
Imagine if you are a black super hero, and save the life of a prejudiced person. Would it change that person's feelings towards black people? Or not? And how would it make you feel about that person?
He could have a white love interest. Thus, it would add an interracial viewpoint.
It would be awesome to have a black hero of that kind of power. Most black super heroes are just not all that powerful, except John Stewart, Luke Cage, Steel, and maybe a couple others. As you had also pointed out....
Blacks should be represented as being on a par with Superman, Batman and Wonder Woman.
I want a hero who happens to be black. He ( Or she. ) could be awakened to being an activist of sorts. And there could also be black super heroes. They could start off being VERY aware of how the world sees them and fighting for many things, including equality, and making black kids aware of the many options in their lives besides crime and drugs.
The possibilities are almost unlimited...and, as I have already stressed, it depends on who is writing the character.
"I offer you a Vulcan prayer, Mr Suder. May your death bring you the peace you never found in life." - Tuvok.
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Agreed. I think Bendis has done a good job with Luke Cage over in New Avengers. He's wiped away that 70's blaxpoitation-angle, and evolved him into a fully-fleshed character...
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That's cool! I'll have to check out NEW AVENGERS, then. I write my own stories. I created a huge ALL STAR SQUADRON type group. Some of the most powerful members are black. There are close to 50 members. About 15 of them are black, and they all have different personalities. Some of them I created over 20 years ago, too.
"I offer you a Vulcan prayer, Mr Suder. May your death bring you the peace you never found in life." - Tuvok.
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As far as the son goes... How long do you suppose they'll be able to hide it from Richard and the boy? I mean the kid took one look at Clark and one look at superman and figured out what the rest of the world could never... that they look exactly the same, save a pair of glasses. So we can rule out any deficieny of the boys dedcutive powers. And the first time the boy decides to throw a tantrum and subsequently another piano, the jig is up unless they throw a pair of glasses on the kid to throw Richard and the rest of the world off the trail.
Putting the "fun" back in Fundamentalist Christian Dogma.
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Quote:
wannabuyamonkey said:
I mean the kid took one look at Clark and one look at superman and figured out what the rest of the world could never...
K...I really need to go see this sober. There are so many things that I failed to notice. Fuck, I barely realized the kid was there, let alone all this shit everyone's pointing out...
If karma's a bitch, it will be my bitch!
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I saw it high as fuck. Shit was tight.
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Quote:
Beardguy57 said:
Actually, Pro, I agree with you. Turning Superman black is a dumb idea. I just want to present possibilities. They could turn him black for 5 or 6 issues. That could be fun, and, if done well, downright fascinating.
I would really rather see a black hero introduced who would be as powerful as Superman.
He could be a terrific role model for black kids.
He would present many new possibilities.
Imagine if you are a black super hero, and save the life of a prejudiced person. Would it change that person's feelings towards black people? Or not? And how would it make you feel about that person?
He could have a white love interest. Thus, it would add an interracial viewpoint.
It would be awesome to have a black hero of that kind of power. Most black super heroes are just not all that powerful, except John Stewart, Luke Cage, Steel, and maybe a couple others. As you had also pointed out....
Blacks should be represented as being on a par with Superman, Batman and Wonder Woman.
I want a hero who happens to be black. He ( Or she. ) could be awakened to being an activist of sorts. And there could also be black super heroes. They could start off being VERY aware of how the world sees them and fighting for many things, including equality, and making black kids aware of the many options in their lives besides crime and drugs.
The possibilities are almost unlimited...and, as I have already stressed, it depends on who is writing the character.
he was called Icon and was part of the Milestone line that DC published for a while. Dwayne Mcduffie of JLU was one of the main creative people involved. it's where Static (of the Static Shock cartoon) came from as well.
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Quote:
Beardguy57 said:
That's cool! I'll have to check out NEW AVENGERS, then. I write my own stories. I created a huge ALL STAR SQUADRON type group. Some of the most powerful members are black. There are close to 50 members. About 15 of them are black, and they all have different personalities. Some of them I created over 20 years ago, too.
post them in the writer's block.
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I agree with most reviews...even animalman's...gah!.
My take on him lifting the island was that after he recharged he picked up the island and a huge amount of earth (volcanic rock) underneath it, because by the time he got up to the atmosphere edge the falling rocks only then revealed the kryptonite and the island itself. So I'm assuming there were many iron and lead lined rocks that were somewhat protecting him to that point. after this he of course fell back to the Earth.
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Quote:
Pig Iron said:
I agree with most reviews...even animalman's...gah!.
My take on him lifting the island was that after he recharged he picked up the island and a huge amount of earth (volcanic rock) underneath it, because by the time he got up to the atmosphere edge the falling rocks only then revealed the kryptonite and the island itself. So I'm assuming there were many iron and lead lined rocks that were somewhat protecting him to that point. after this he of course fell back to the Earth.
 
We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit. - Aristotle
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I just saw it.....I loved it. Great movie.
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Steven Grant's Permanent Damage column Quote:
I still haven't seen SUPERMAN RETURNS, probably won't unless somebody spots me in, but the reviews and box office furor have been fascinating. How do you have a film pull in $52 million in three days and be projected for over a hundred mil in a week, and have industry analysts call it a bomb? When production topped two hundred mil. (In the economy of Hollywood, that translates to roughly half a billion dollars when other costs like printing, shipping and promotion, though some of that gets paid back via merchandising tie-ins, though, I'd assume, a lot of that would get credited to DC Comics. Or should be, if it isn't.) No doubt they'll eventually make all their money back on foreign and ancillary (AKA DVD) markets, but Hollywood studios don't want to just make their money back, they want to make lots and lots of profit, something no studio has been seeing much of lately. Factor in that the July 4th weekend is traditionally among the hottest film weekends of the year, and Hollywood's general response to the response to SUPERMAN RETURNS is dour. (By comparison, the counter-release THE DEVIL WORE PRADA took in $27 mil over the weekend, and is being touted as a hit, mainly because it well exceeded expectations - it more than survived against SUPERMAN RETURNS, for one thing - and it cost a hell of a lot less to make.)
The reviews have been ambivalent as well. Virtually everyone noted it was an "homage" to the 1977 Richard Donner SUPERMAN, though whether it was an improvement, a modernization, or a knockoff appears subject to debate. More than a few noted the Christian allegory infused into the material. Others noted something a lot of Superman fans just don't want to recognize: Superman is no longer enough.
The Donner film was launched with the tagline "You'll believe a man can fly." A friend of mine said the theme of the new film was "You'll believe a man can lift heavy things." When SUPERMAN was released, superhero films were a rare thing, and even then watching someone flying on a movie screen wasn't that big a deal, but we were willing to ignore that, just for the novelty of Superman. What you saw of the character in the media was most the relatively inept SUPERFRIENDS style cartoons; to the general population, the film version did genuinely round out and humanize the character some. But now superhero films are fairly common, and no longer stigmatized; watching a character fly is nothing compared to watching a character fly while on fire! (Hawkman, in the comics, fell victim to a similar trend; when Hawkman began, the idea of someone flying like a bird was still a relative novelty, but by the time Hawkman returned in the '60s, there were very few characters who didn't fly and the character never again achieved the popularity it had known in the 1940s. Or Ant-Man, who was never very popular and had, as John Belushi disdainfully put it on a SATURDAY NIGHT LIVE, "the proportional strength of a human!") The ante has upped. Even strictly on the terms of the character, Superman has had a great run in various SUPERMAN and JUSTICE LEAGUE cartoons; any film version has to live up to perceptions of them as well, and those were far more sophisticated versions of the character than have even appeared in most recent comics.
The problem with Superman is that the character really doesn't make any sense. Oh, at the core he does: an orphan using his extraordinary abilities to protect his adoptive home. There's an emotional tug there that's simple to grasp. But no one seems to have any faith in that core anymore. What creators in particular fix on is the trappings. And the trappings are what don't make sense, particularly to the young. Why on earth does Superman need a costume? Answer: he doesn't. Why does Superman need a secret identity? Answer: he doesn't. I know a lot of Superman fans out there are now shrieking "Objection! Asked and answered, your honor!" because comics have answered questions like these time and time again, but the problem there is that the answers make no sense. Superman hears a cry for help, and pauses from the rescue to change clothes! He needs a secret identity so he can live "a normal life"? Why would he want to? He's Superman. So he, as reporter Clark Kent, can stay on top of the news so Superman knows where all the emergencies are? Like Clark Kent covers all that? So he can fairly win Lois Lane's heart? But he's really Superman! Why does he insist she fall for his cover story? Why would he even want to take the time off from being Superman? Isn't Superman supposed to be out there helping people?
Conversely, Batman makes sense, even now. He wants to avenge his parents' death. He dresses as Batman because the costume scares criminals and adds to his mystique. Spider-Man makes sense. He's a neurotic college kid who suddenly gains strange powers and realizes their potential for screwing up his life but feels a responsibility to use them, so he creates a second identity for himself. But Superman doesn't need any of that. He's Superman, and the trappings that weigh him down were really little considered Jerry Siegel cribs from his source materials, like dual identity of THE SCARLET PIMPERNEL, if not much later additions by other hands.
But way too many people, particularly within the comics community, identify Superman with his trappings and consider them immutable, and those trappings are no longer relevant. They're just confusing, and where they may once have given the character the sense of a more "real" existence, today the effect is the opposite.
Which is, perhaps, why some fans and creators have spent the past few years beating to death the idea of Superman as Christ allegory, which apparently strongly surfaces in the new film via Superman's dad, Jor-El, a long dead disembodied voice who now no longer sent his "only son" to Earth because that was the only available planet with humanoid life his telescope could find, but to "save" them - and, of course, ala the 1992 "Death of Superman" arc, which started up a lot of this nonsense, his apparent death seems to cast the world into darkness until he rises to fulfill his mission of earthly salvation. Good god, literally. For Christians, isn't this new identification of Superman with Christ a bit, um, blasphemous? (Not that he's the only heavy-handed Christ analog floating around comics in the last couple decades, by a long shot, and the whole bit is more than a little tired.) And why would anyone who's not a Christian have even the slightest interest in this?
Anyway, if Jerry Siegel had any Biblical analogies in mind for Superman, it was almost surely Moses, cast incognito down the Nile to adoption as a baby to save his life and let him grow to be a man of greatness, than Jesus. And maybe he just shares Moses' destiny as well: to deliver his people to the Promised Land, but be unable to enter himself.
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That was awesome, Grimm, thank you for posting that.
"I offer you a Vulcan prayer, Mr Suder. May your death bring you the peace you never found in life." - Tuvok.
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it's one of my favorite weekly columns.
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PJP said:
I just saw it.....I loved it. Great movie.
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Quote:
Grimm said:
Why does Superman need a secret identity? Answer: he doesn't. I know a lot of Superman fans out there are now shrieking "Objection! Asked and answered, your honor!" because comics have answered questions like these time and time again, but the problem there is that the answers make no sense. Superman hears a cry for help, and pauses from the rescue to change clothes! He needs a secret identity so he can live "a normal life"? Why would he want to? He's Superman. So he, as reporter Clark Kent, can stay on top of the news so Superman knows where all the emergencies are? Like Clark Kent covers all that? So he can fairly win Lois Lane's heart? But he's really Superman! Why does he insist she fall for his cover story? Why would he even want to take the time off from being Superman? Isn't Superman supposed to be out there helping people?
A very myopic view of Superman in my opinion. Who wants to never leave work?
whomod said: I generally don't like it when people decide to play by the rules against people who don't play by the rules. It tends to put you immediately at a disadvantage and IMO is a sign of true weakness. This is true both in politics and on the internet." Our Friendly Neighborhood Ray-man said: "no, the doctor's right. besides, he has seniority."
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Once in the 1970s, they had a story with a very logical, short and simple answer. Clark was pondering giving up his identity and then thought to himself, "Nah, being Superman is like being rich. You'd always wonder if people would like you without it." Worked for me. But more importantly, for all the efforts of Singer, et al, to make Superman about "godhood" they are forgetting that one of the classic archetypes of myths and legends is the god or king who pretends to be a common human. Superman and Clark Kent tie into that basic, powerful, myth. Don't any of these people study Joseph Campbell any more?
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Quote:
the G-man said:
Once in the 1970s, they had a story with a very logical, short and simple answer. Clark was pondering giving up his identity and then thought to himself, "Nah, being Superman is like being rich. You'd always wonder if people would like you without it."
Worked for me.
But more importantly, for all the efforts of Singer, et al, to make Superman about "godhood" they are forgetting that one of the classic archetypes of myths and legends is the god or king who pretends to be a common human. Superman and Clark Kent tie into that basic, powerful, myth.
Don't any of these people study Joseph Campbell any more?
I forget which one it was, but I think Shakespeare wrote a play like that.
"I offer you a Vulcan prayer, Mr Suder. May your death bring you the peace you never found in life." - Tuvok.
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 19,546 Likes: 1
living in 1962 15000+ posts
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living in 1962 15000+ posts
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Quote:
thedoctor said:
Quote:
Grimm said:
Why does Superman need a secret identity? Answer: he doesn't. I know a lot of Superman fans out there are now shrieking "Objection! Asked and answered, your honor!" because comics have answered questions like these time and time again, but the problem there is that the answers make no sense. Superman hears a cry for help, and pauses from the rescue to change clothes! He needs a secret identity so he can live "a normal life"? Why would he want to? He's Superman. So he, as reporter Clark Kent, can stay on top of the news so Superman knows where all the emergencies are? Like Clark Kent covers all that? So he can fairly win Lois Lane's heart? But he's really Superman! Why does he insist she fall for his cover story? Why would he even want to take the time off from being Superman? Isn't Superman supposed to be out there helping people?
A very myopic view of Superman in my opinion. Who wants to never leave work?
Steven Grant said that. Pay attention, reax.
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 32,001 Likes: 1
We already are 15000+ posts
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We already are 15000+ posts
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Quote:
PJP said:
Quote:
PJP said:
I just saw it.....I loved it. Great movie.
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 24,593 Likes: 1
Timelord. Drunkard. 15000+ posts
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Timelord. Drunkard. 15000+ posts
Joined: Jun 2002
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Quote:
Grimm said:
Quote:
thedoctor said:
Quote:
Grimm said:
Why does Superman need a secret identity? Answer: he doesn't. I know a lot of Superman fans out there are now shrieking "Objection! Asked and answered, your honor!" because comics have answered questions like these time and time again, but the problem there is that the answers make no sense. Superman hears a cry for help, and pauses from the rescue to change clothes! He needs a secret identity so he can live "a normal life"? Why would he want to? He's Superman. So he, as reporter Clark Kent, can stay on top of the news so Superman knows where all the emergencies are? Like Clark Kent covers all that? So he can fairly win Lois Lane's heart? But he's really Superman! Why does he insist she fall for his cover story? Why would he even want to take the time off from being Superman? Isn't Superman supposed to be out there helping people?
A very myopic view of Superman in my opinion. Who wants to never leave work?
Steven Grant said that. Pay attention, reax.
Yeah, I know. I was commenting on it, Ghost Rider.
whomod said: I generally don't like it when people decide to play by the rules against people who don't play by the rules. It tends to put you immediately at a disadvantage and IMO is a sign of true weakness. This is true both in politics and on the internet." Our Friendly Neighborhood Ray-man said: "no, the doctor's right. besides, he has seniority."
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 19,546 Likes: 1
living in 1962 15000+ posts
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living in 1962 15000+ posts
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 19,546 Likes: 1 |
Quote:
thedoctor said:
Quote:
Grimm said:
Quote:
thedoctor said:
Quote:
Grimm said:
Why does Superman need a secret identity? Answer: he doesn't. I know a lot of Superman fans out there are now shrieking "Objection! Asked and answered, your honor!" because comics have answered questions like these time and time again, but the problem there is that the answers make no sense. Superman hears a cry for help, and pauses from the rescue to change clothes! He needs a secret identity so he can live "a normal life"? Why would he want to? He's Superman. So he, as reporter Clark Kent, can stay on top of the news so Superman knows where all the emergencies are? Like Clark Kent covers all that? So he can fairly win Lois Lane's heart? But he's really Superman! Why does he insist she fall for his cover story? Why would he even want to take the time off from being Superman? Isn't Superman supposed to be out there helping people?
A very myopic view of Superman in my opinion. Who wants to never leave work?
Steven Grant said that. Pay attention, reax.
Yeah, I know. I was commenting on it, Ghost Rider.
then read and comment on the rest, Sylvester McCoy.
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Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 33,385 Likes: 4
Regenerated 15000+ posts
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Regenerated 15000+ posts
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My question would be, why are people always looking for something "relatable" about them? It's all fiction. SUPERHERO fiction, at that. It's not neccessarily supposed to be relatable to real life. If you can find something to grasp and relate with, fine. More power. But, in the end, it's really just suppose to be...you know.... fun. He lifts things. He flies. He's invulnerable. He's Superman. I wish they would stop looking for goddman Shakespeare in there......they're not going to find it... 
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Joined: May 2003
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We already are 15000+ posts
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We already are 15000+ posts
Joined: May 2003
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Joined: Feb 2001
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Regenerated 15000+ posts
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Regenerated 15000+ posts
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.......um......yes? No? Toothpaste?  
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 32,001 Likes: 1
We already are 15000+ posts
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We already are 15000+ posts
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Quote:
PJP said:
Quote:
PJP said:
Quote:
PJP said:
I just saw it.....I loved it. Great movie.
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Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 33,385 Likes: 4
Regenerated 15000+ posts
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Regenerated 15000+ posts
Joined: Feb 2001
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Joined: May 2001
Posts: 6,236
The Swizzler.... 6000+ posts
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The Swizzler.... 6000+ posts
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So far, I've seen the movie twice. The second time was at the IMAX a couple of hours ago.
Before I continue..............you've been WARNED!!!!!
No seriously..........Im gonna spoil it.........don't gripe at me later pjs!
So seeing it on the IMAX TOTALLY ROCKED! The action shots were sweet (not all of it was 3d but hey) seeing it on the freakin' huge screen was AMAZING. My only complaint for IMAX was that they didn't show the final Superman lifting up the krypty island into space in 3d but everything else was really nice. Killer Lois scene where Supesy saves her and lover boy from the dark waters not to mention the opening plane diving scene. Totally worth the price of admission for just that coupla of minutes! Not to mention seeing the WHOLE MOVIE on a HUGE IMAX SCREEN!!!! So done gloating......sorta ;P
Besides the blatant comic quotes (which Jeff pointed out a couple of the ones I missed), I loved the timing of the movie. When Lex was stealing the kryptonite from the museum, there was a machine gun going off at the bank and Kitty driving agressively (just like a woman huh?!?) down the street so even "superman missed that" as Lois would later refer to in Perry's office.
As for timing, HOW MANY OF YOU GUYS guessed that the kids was supermans?!? Huh?!? HUH?!?
Yeah, I guessed it at the beginning...yeah....im gloating BIG TIME! Really unexpected the way they casted the sickly kid who would later save his mommy from a vicious bad guy but couldn't even open a steel door a coupla minutes later. Plus, it was kinda nice having Richard show up to save Lois in the ship BEFORE superman showed up (that was cool after he was asked how he got there so quickly, Mr. Cyclops Jr. replied, "i flew." NICENESS! Kinda glad jean killed him off. Oopsy.......Xmen3 spoilers *darn I feel so bad?!?  *). Not to mention the fact that big, bad, Lexy guessed that the kiddo was Supers even if he didnt show a reaction to the kryptonite. I'm still wondering why he let them drown in the ship (except it was being destroyed by kryptonite so he figured the kiddo would get killed).
(Side tangent, 'cuz you guys probably aren't reading this post anyways.....) SOOOOOOOO my parents (gotta love em) raised an interesting question. Any of you guys notice how Superman shadowed Passion of the Christ?!? Okay....at least to be rkmb politically correct, "The Christ like figure." Note the blatant "savior" references aka when he's in space listening to the cries of humanity on the earth. Also when Superman's being beaten up by the henchmen, to the driving of the kryptonite in his back (like the crown on Christ's head), the way superman collapsed down into the water basically "dying" until he "rises again" being saved by Lois), to the picturesque Christ scene (after saving humanity from the krypty island) when he falls to earth with his hands outspread like he was on a cross as were his feet *watch for it next time, PROMISE!*. Pretty interesting.......and the whole movie seemed to show that even Superman needs a savior. "Whoda thunk it"?!?
As for my favorite scenes (besides the ones stated above), I loved the way how Clark met the kid before Lois or Richard and how they seemingly clicked (forshadowing....gotta love it), the way the kid pointed out Superman drowning in the waters, the way the kid was touching superman's costume in the hospital, and the way the kid kissed him goodbye (and, yes, you do have a brain if you realize I can't remember the kiddos name! I'm so proud of you Maybe JLA can give you some rack points for noticing the obvious ).
One thought kept going through my mind: HOW the kid kissed him goodbye in the hospital. I always had to kiss my grandmother as a kid on the SIDE of her face but this kid leaps up on the bed, and kisses him on the center of his forehead as if he knows something....Note also how the kid interacts with Richard when he hugs him and when he kisses him......dum da dum!!!!!!!!!
Gotta admire Lois as a character. Kate Bosworth may be no Oscar winning actress but that girl pulled off a killer Lois who never stopped fithing/digging/researching/"digging for truth" even though she sure did a crappy job of her own life. Can't wait to see what they do with the next movie, "oh wait, richard, see the kid's not yours. It's supermans but you should love me and trust me anyways, yeah, even if I did kiss him in the hospital room." Plus ya'll already raised the issue of whether the kid will resent superman for leaving him or not. LOOOVVEEED the Father/Son speech *really, REALLY cool*, and DEFINITELY awesome on the IMAX. Especially when the camera zooms out and you see this HUGE shot of Superman with his hand on the boy's head. WOW...........almost makes me *gulps* tear up *uh....not really but close!*
However all that drama plays out, the kiddo might just follow in his momma's footsteps. Afer all, the man in the red cape DID tell Lois goodbye on the plane towards the end of the movie........NIIIICE touch. In the words of my sister, "that boy learns quick!" So much is Lois changed that you gotta love the facial shot of Louis in the final scene which basically looks like shes thinking, "oh my gosh, I made a mistake. I shoulda waited for Supsy! What shall happen in the future?!? Oh well, at any rate, I'm sure the next superman movie will help me deal with my life since, as a woman, I've made a total mess of it. Back to the kitchen to write, 'why I love my supesy.'"
FINALLY TWO WORDS: John Williams. Wow.......the boy can turn even the most unthoughtful musical pieces into a symphony and built up to shadow the end of the scene. Espeically how "heart and soul" melted from a stupid piano piece into a symphony which shadowed all the way to the end of the minute long scene. How many movies has the guy done soundtracks for and how many of them sound the same?!? The guy's a genius.....totally and completely a genius.
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