RKMBs Forums .::Important::. Politics and Current Events Mildred Loving, matriarch of interracial marriage, dies

Well at least you didn't flame me.


bsams, as I said, my opinion is based on not one specific post or even any 4 or 5 that I could search for and quote here.

It's based on the overall tone of many of your posts thru the years...at the Manor, at where ever we went when the Manor blew up...especially during the time after 9/11...and some of the things you've written here.

Again...it's tone. As far as I know you've never out and out admitted to being against minorities. It just seems that way to me. Others may not see it that way. I do.

The fact that you are white means little or nothing to me. I tend not to lump people together and judge them as groups. The fact that you are white doesn't automatically make you or anyone else a racist or bigot or whatever. It also doesn't exclude you from the same..just as being black neither automaytically includes or excludes me.

As far as you never having a negative experience with minority...I never said you did. I don't think that one has to have a directly negative experience to be negatative towards a certain group. My impression of you is that you are simply a product of your environment.

As far as me being racist or bigoted or whatever you wish to refer to me as...I expected that you would say as much. Your typical debating style is to try to turn whatever is being said about you back to the person that said it. I figure that you will respond to this post with one of your other tactics...editing my words to reflect something other than what I'm saying or unilaterally declaring yourself the "winner" without ever truly debating a point.

If you really feel that way, you are as entitled to your opinion as I am to mine. Let me just say this:

I grew up in a racially diverse neighborhood. It was probably 65/35 black to white with a couple of hispanic families thrown in for good measure. From pre-school to 6th grade the schools I attended were majority white...about 70/30. I was in a program for accelereted kids from 3rd grade on and most of my classes were almost all white. 7th and 8th grade found me transferred to a different school that was about 60/40 black to white. It was a neighborhood school that accurately refected the part of town that I lived in. I went to a fairly exclusive high school that was about 65% white. By exclusive, I mean that you had to take an entrance exam to get into it. All though my elementary, middle and high school career, I hung out with people of all races. I dated girls of all races. I competed in sports with and against people of all colors. I learned to deal with people as individuals before anything.

My first 2 years in college were spent at a satellite of the University of Pittsburgh which was in a town that was about 99% white. The school itself was about 85% or more white. This was the place that I first really encountered overt racism. I was called nigger to my face by more white people there than at any other point in my life. I dated girls who couldn't be seen with me in the street, let alone bring me to meet their families...one of whom got the shit beaten out of her by her own brother cuz she was messing around with a black guy. I socialized with people that had never seen a real live black person. Some were shocked that I can't play basketball. Some were in awe that I can communicate in standard english. Some were amazed that I liked music other than Rap and R&B. In other words, some people couldn't beleieve that I was not very different from them.

The last 3 years I was in college, I went to Pitt proper. I hung out with many people of all races though, admittedly, most of my closest friends were black. Still, most of my classmates were white and I spent quite a bit of time with them either studying, working on some project or doing jello shots and drinking $1 pitchers at any one of the (predominatly white) bars on campus. I had a dual major of sociology and psychology which lent itself very well to discussion of racism as a social phenomenon...both as a requirement of classwork and a topic of interest outside of school.

My first 2 years out of school were spent in a job where most of my co-workers and most of the clients were white. My next 10 years were spent at a job where most of my co-workers and clients were balck. My years since then...2001...have been spent in a position where most of my co-workers and clients were white.

At every point in my life since I was maybe 12 years old, I've taken every chance afforded to me to really talk to people of other races about race relations. I've always wanted to hear the perspective of those that don't look like me to affirm the truth of what I've always suspected: We are basically all the same or to hear their reasoning for the opposite.

I've had several negative experiences with white people and with minorities. Some were definitely race based, some were because I or the other person was an asshole at the time.

I have been the only black guy in the crowd or in the class or in the bar. I've been one of only four black people (5 if you count my son who was 18 months at the time) at a family reunion of over 200. I've had converstaions with the most liberal sufferers of white guilt. I've had converstaions with unrepenatent racists..white and otherwise. I've had white people champion my aspirations. I've had white people try to bring me down.

I refuse to let how any one or even several individuals act color (excuse the pun) my perceptions of the group to which they are most easily grouped with.

I don't expect any of that to mean anything to you. As you've made quite clear in your post, if I happen think you are intolerant of people that don't look like you, then it must to mean that I am the racist.

Re: me beating you up cuz you're white....Dude.

I'm too old for that shit. Besides, you're bigger than me. I'd only fight you if I had to. And you'd probably pull some of that WWE shit on me and beat the shit out of me. I'm black but, I'm not stupid.

Oh...and for the record, I know several people that believe as Rev. Wright does. They may be misguided but, they aren't racist. It would be to your benefit to find out why someone beleives things you don't rather than just dismoss them as racist. It may open you up to another worldview that, while not your own, could lead you to a better understanding of the world in which you live. You know...the one outside of your comfort zone.

You wanna really discuss this...? I'm open to it.

You wanna leave it as it is and walk away from it...? Fine.

You wanna follow me from post to post and say something disparaging about me or create an alt to do the same....? Whatever.

I've known you for a long time, bsams. I don't think that you are a bad person. I just think that you don't know what you don't know.

Take it how you want to.