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Quote:
the G-man said:
Given the reality that the terrorists would consider even a partially successful attack on the sitting president a major strategic victory, as opposed to a Senator with a wishy washy record on support said president, I think it fair to say that Hillary was never in the same level of danger as the President.
killing an ex-president's wife who is a senator is a pretty big prize. hell, letterman may've been a bigger target than either of them.
Bow ties are coool.
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That's a little like arguing killing one of Osama Bin Laden's wives would be as good as killing Osama in regards to the war on terror.
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Quote:
the G-man said:
That's a little like arguing killing one of Osama Bin Laden's wives would be as good as killing Osama in regards to the war on terror.
big difference. big difference.
huge difference.
god, are you retarded?
i mean...what the fuck?
Bow ties are coool.
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Quote:
r3x29yz4a said:
Quote:
the G-man said:
That's a little like arguing killing one of Osama Bin Laden's wives would be as good as killing Osama in regards to the war on terror.
big difference. big difference.
huge difference.
god, are you retarded?
i mean...what the fuck?
I've said it before. When it comes to talking about any Clinton, many people from the right lose their composure. G-man comparing Clinton (former first lady, current Senator & likely presidential candidate) to one of Osama's wives being such an example.
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You forget, Ray and MEM, that we are trying to look at this from the perspective of what a member of Al Quaeda would think.
Those individuals are, of course, radical Muslims, practictioners of a belief system that generally holds women as inferior to, if not property of, men.
Whether she is a Senator or not, Hillary Clinton is going to be viewed by those radical Muslims as little more than a piece of property of an ex-president and, therefore, hardly of the same import as a current president.
Less importance, less motive to kill her.
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Quote:
the G-man said:
You forget, Ray and MEM, that we are trying to look at this from the perspective of what a member of Al Quaeda would think.
Those individuals are, of course, radical Muslims, practictioners of a belief system that generally holds women as inferior to, if not property of, men.
Whether she is a Senator or not, Hillary Clinton is going to be viewed by those radical Muslims as little more than a piece of property of an ex-president and, therefore, hardly of the same import as a current president.
Less importance, less motive to kill her.
1. Never underestimate the appeal of a blonde.
2. You still fail to recognize Letterman as the bigger target.
Bow ties are coool.
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House vote to back war puts Dems on defensiveThe House on Friday voted 256-153 to support the military mission in Iraq
Forty-two Democrats bucked their leadership to join a virtually united Republican Party and declare that the United States must complete "the mission to create a sovereign, free, secure and united Iraq" without setting "an arbitrary date for the withdrawal or redeployment" of U.S. troops.
"The American public deserves to hear how their elected leaders will respond to international terrorism and those enemies who seek to destroy our American way of life. Will we fight or will we retreat?" asked House Majority Leader John Boehner of Ohio. "Let me be clear: Those who say this is a war of choice are nothing more than wrong. This is a war of necessity."
Rep. John Murtha of Pennsylvania, the hawkish [?] Democrat who rocked Capitol Hill last year by calling for a rapid withdrawal of forces, said, "We've become the enemy. We've given a microphone to people like Zarqawi. We support the troops. It's the policy we don't support." So, 'cut and run' is now hawkish? Don't be so hard on yourself and your fellow Democrats, Mr. Murtha. I think Zarqawi biting the big one, on the heels of the special election in California to replace Duke Cunningham, AND no Rove indictment just sent the Democratic leadership completely over the edge. That's three huge whammies in less than a week, and being as they're already unbalanced, this triple play just sent them right where they were already headed. This not only took immigration off the front pages, but it revitalized a demoralized GOP and its base. Finally, the whole William Jefferson fiasco didn't help them. They're not even bothering to hide the fact they're basing all their hopes for the midterms on our defeat in Iraq. I knew their hopes for winning back the House in November were slim, at best. But now they're admitting what the GOP was saying all along: "They're not serious about foreign policy or defense". Nancy Pelosi can go ahead and cancel those new drapes for the Speaker's office.
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Anyone notice G-man's post is less about defending a position than atacking folks for their position? Time for some facts. Murtha has risked more than any of you guys on this board for this country. As a politician he's backed & supported using the troops not based on party politics but whats in the best interest of the country. In this case he sees the situation as either pulling the troops out now or keeping them in longer as target practice. His experience is telling him it's a case of how many troops do you want to lose. You may not agree with that but there it is.
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And, one would think, that means that Murtha is able to withstand criticism when he's wrong.
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Well I truly hope he is but I doubt it.
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Yeah, you're right. He probably can't. Ironically, as you attack me for what you see as unfair criticism of Murtha, we find that Murtha himself is making personal attacks on the physical appearance of people with whom he disagrees: Commenting on Karl Rove's remarks in a speech in New Hampshire where he charged that Democrats are "wrong, profoundly wrong" in wanting to cut and run in Iraq, an increasingly rabid anti-war Congressman John Murtha resorted to a personal attack on Rove on Sunday.
"He's in New Hampshire, he's making a political speech. He's sitting in his air-conditioned office on his big fat backside saying, 'Stay the course,'" said Murtha
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I saw Murtha make the comments you quoted, G-Man.
(Regarding Rove's girth rather than the merits of the issue discussed by Rove.)
It was during this past Sunday's MEET THE PRESS, where Murtha was interviewed. (This link is to the complete video of the program online.)
Murtha pisses me off. I've seen him interviewed several times, his mind is clearly made up, and he irritably shouts down anyone who challenges his opinion, not even allowing the counter-argument to his views to be voiced.
Murtha is one of a growing crop of Democrats voicing bitterly divisive rhetoric, where because of their military record or alleged suffering, Democrats consider it evil to so much as give a counter-argument to what these liberals argue. And equally evil to (gasp, choke !) question their record or credibility.
John Kerry, Cindy Sheehan, several 9-11 widows critical of Bush, now John Murtha... and the list just builds.
I frankly think Murtha is a blowhard, who exploits the emotion of the issue. And has largely argued with emotion over substance to assert his views.
So don't nominate this guy for sainthood just yet. He's playing partisan politics.
And I'd add Murtha to my list of Democrats who truly understand what's at stake, but emotionally posture to score points with their liberal voter-base, against what they know to be the nation's best interest for victory in Iraq.
Because they know they can posture and score points with liberal voters, while Bush will continue do the right thing in Iraq regardless.
- from Do Racists have lower IQ's...
Liberals who bemoan discrimination, intolerance, restraint of Constitutional freedoms, and promotion of hatred toward various abberant minorities, have absolutely no problem with discriminating against, being intolerant of, restricting Constitutional freedoms of, and directing hate-filled scapegoat rhetoric against conservatives.
EXACTLY what they accuse Republicans/conservatives of doing, is EXACTLY what liberals/Democrats do themselves, to those who oppose their beliefs.
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Quote:
the G-man said:
Yeah, you're right. He probably can't.
Ironically, as you attack me for what you see as unfair criticism of Murtha, we find that Murtha himself is making personal attacks on the physical appearance of people with whom he disagrees:
Commenting on Karl Rove's remarks in a speech in New Hampshire where he charged that Democrats are "wrong, profoundly wrong" in wanting to cut and run in Iraq, an increasingly rabid anti-war Congressman John Murtha resorted to a personal attack on Rove on Sunday.
"He's in New Hampshire, he's making a political speech. He's sitting in his air-conditioned office on his big fat backside saying, 'Stay the course,'" said Murtha
Allas, after searching the web for images of Karl Roves ass I've been unable to locate a clear shot.
I DID find the following, however:
Look like it's potentially quite large.
This purports to be a photo of Rove's asshole. Note the flames.
The lack of testicles tends to verify it authenticity.
The fact that no clear images of Rove's backside on the internet suggests that he has something to hide.
Finally, here is further evidence that indeed, Rove does have a fat ass and Congressman Murtha's statement is accurate if perhaps unkind.
Finally, having viewed 400 images in the hunt for Karl's ass, I'm off to drink myself to death. Catch my byline in SF Chronicle Obits.
(Edited to remove non-work safe pics)
Last edited by the G-man; 2006-06-20 1:20 AM.
"Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives." John Stuart Mill
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He who dies with the most toys is nonetheless dead.
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We can only hope. 
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Considering that Rove was basically calling Murtha a coward, why is it a surprise that Murtha responded? Better yet, Murtha didn't say anything that wasn't true. Rove is fat. Rove is far removed from the battle in Iraq & is indeed mostly in air conditioning.
I saw the mentioned Meet The Press with Murtha & the Rove clip. He spent a couple of seconds on Rove. I can see why all the Bush cheer leaders are waving their pom poms furiously at Murtha though. He's quite clearly not afraid of them though.
Fair play!
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Quote:
Matter-eater Man said:
Considering that Rove was basically calling Murtha a coward, why is it a surprise that Murtha responded? Better yet, Murtha didn't say anything that wasn't true. Rove is fat. Rove is far removed from the battle in Iraq & is indeed mostly in air conditioning.
Hillary Clinton, for example, is well know for having a fairly large posterior of her own. She has also been known to refer to republicans as having all sorts of ill motives in the past, most notably, of course, the "vast right wing conspiracy" charge. Some of her accusations against republicans are at least as inflammatory as accusing someone of cowardice.
Given those facts, are you saying that you would support a republican senator making reference to her "fat ass" on national television in lieu of actually responding to the issue at hand?
After all, its not as if Rove was any thinner in 2002, when Murtha voted for the war. So what does Rove's weight have to do with the issue of Iraq?
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Hillar squeezed out a puppy, she's entitled to have a fat ass! Rove's done nothing but pinch loafs his entire miserable life! Give that man a colonoscopy and bring the big probe!
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Quote:
Captain Sammitch said:
We can only hope.
Et tu, Sammitch?
"Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives." John Stuart Mill
America is the only country that went from barbarism to decadence without civilization in between. Oscar Wilde
He who dies with the most toys is nonetheless dead.
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Quote:
Matter-eater Man said:
Considering that Rove was basically calling Murtha a coward, why is it a surprise that Murtha responded? Better yet, Murtha didn't say anything that wasn't true. Rove is fat. Rove is far removed from the battle in Iraq & is indeed mostly in air conditioning.
You'd have to provide a specific quote, to prove that Rove made similar bitterly personal insults toward Murtha.
I saw video of Rove, of the speech in question and he doesn't call Murtha or any of the Democrats cowards. Rove simply says liberals consistently pursue the wrong policy, of "cut and run".
To me "cut and run" implies lack of commitment to the proper action necessary.
I don't think "cut and run" implies cowardice.
"Cut and run" merely implies doing the easiest thing, implies following a path of political expediency, rather than of acting in the long term best interest of the U.S.
Which granted, makes Democrats/liberals look bad in a different way. But it's not the same as calling Murtha a coward.
Rove simply says Murtha (and other Dems) are pursuing the wrong policy.
Which is a lot more civil, and much more a discussion of the issue, than Murtha calling Rove a fat-ass.
I might add, Murtha should look in the mirror before he makes such statements about others.
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Quote:
the G-man said:
Quote:
Matter-eater Man said:
Considering that Rove was basically calling Murtha a coward, why is it a surprise that Murtha responded? Better yet, Murtha didn't say anything that wasn't true. Rove is fat. Rove is far removed from the battle in Iraq & is indeed mostly in air conditioning.
... So what does Rove's weight have to do with the issue of Iraq?
Rove's fat ass really doesn't have much to do with Iraq beyond his spinning the war for the GOP. Rove just wasn't worth much of Murtha's time.
Fair play!
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Given that Rove is considerably higher up the political chain, I'd say it's Murtha who is unworthy of Rove's time.
Quote:
magicjay38 said:
Quote:
Captain Sammitch said:
We can only hope.
Et tu, Sammitch?
Aww, now can't we all just play nice ?
I think Sammitch meant that a bit lighter than it came across, but I still don't agree with his post.
I'm content just to politically disagree with you, M Jay.
Although I often find myself agreeing with you too, on a number of less partisan issues.
But when you go all Republican-hating or tranny on me, I move to the other side of the room. 
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Quote:
magicjay38 said:
Quote:
Captain Sammitch said:
We can only hope.
Et tu, Sammitch?
 I think you know me better than that.
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Quote:
Wonder Boy said:
Quote:
Matter-eater Man said:
Considering that Rove was basically calling Murtha a coward, why is it a surprise that Murtha responded? Better yet, Murtha didn't say anything that wasn't true. Rove is fat. Rove is far removed from the battle in Iraq & is indeed mostly in air conditioning.
You'd have to provide a specific quote, to prove that Rove made similar bitterly personal insults toward Murtha.
I saw video of Rove, of the speech in question and he doesn't call Murtha or any of the Democrats cowards. Rove simply says liberals consistently pursue the wrong policy, of "cut and run".
To me "cut and run" implies lack of commitment to the proper action necessary.
I don't think "cut and run" implies cowardice.
"Cut and run" merely implies doing the easiest thing, implies following a path of political expediency, rather than of acting in the long term best interest of the U.S.
Which granted, makes Democrats/liberals look bad in a different way. But it's not the same as calling Murtha a coward.
Rove simply says Murtha (and other Dems) are pursuing the wrong policy.
Which is a lot more civil, and much more a discussion of the issue, than Murtha calling Rove a fat-ass.
I might add, Murtha should look in the mirror before he makes such statements about others.
You must be unfamiliar with the phrase "That cowards cut & run" Odd, since it's been said quite a bit lately. In fact Rep. Jean Schmidt's (R-OH) aimed the comment right at Murtha in Congress not to long ago.
Quote:
Given that Rove is considerably higher up the political chain, I'd say it's Murtha who is unworthy of Rove's time.
I think you forget what Rove's job entails. He's basically a salesman for his party & especially his President. Murtha's views are a threat in that aspect. It's his job to spin for the President & work against those that threaten the President's popularity.
Fair play!
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Murtha's job is far higher up the food chain than Rove's. Murtha is an ELECTED official, Rove is a political appointee. Murtha has a constituency, Rove does not. Rove has never been elected to anything.
"Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives." John Stuart Mill
America is the only country that went from barbarism to decadence without civilization in between. Oscar Wilde
He who dies with the most toys is nonetheless dead.
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Quote:
Wonder Boy said:
Given that Rove is considerably higher up the political chain, I'd say it's Murtha who is unworthy of Rove's time.
Quote:
magicjay38 said:
Quote:
Captain Sammitch said:
We can only hope.
Et tu, Sammitch?
Aww, now can't we all just play nice ?
I think Sammitch meant that a bit lighter than it came across, but I still don't agree with his post.
I'm content just to politically disagree with you, M Jay.
Although I often find myself agreeing with you too, on a number of less partisan issues.
But when you go all Republican-hating or tranny on me, I move to the other side of the room.
I was just returning his volly. The ball is still in play! 
BTW Republican bashing is fair play. Look at the things you say about Democrats and Liberals. And I don't hate all Repubs. I even voted for Jerry Ford over St. Jimmy of GA and I'd do the same today. Sanctimonious people of both parties annoy me. My dislike of Reagan has deep roots. Remember, he was Governor of California for 8 years (Yes, even we beautiful people make mistakes)!
I am transexual and have endured a fair amount of insults in silence on this board. So, ya, on gender and gay issues I can be a real bitch. Just think about sleeping with Pariah...eeewww! On second thought, don't!!!!
I do find many of your posts to be well thought out and written even when I disagree.
"Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives." John Stuart Mill
America is the only country that went from barbarism to decadence without civilization in between. Oscar Wilde
He who dies with the most toys is nonetheless dead.
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Quote:
magicjay38 said:
Hillar squeezed out a puppy, she's entitled to have a fat ass! Rove's done nothing but pinch loafs his entire miserable life! ...
So, what's your excuse?
Putting the "fun" back in Fundamentalist Christian Dogma.
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Quote:
Matter-eater Man said:
Rove's fat ass really doesn't have much to do with Iraq beyond his spinning the war for the GOP. Rove just wasn't worth much of Murtha's time.
This is a telling point. It tends to demonstrate the current mindset of the democratic leadership, to wit, that they don't really want to engage in dialogue.
If debating the war isn't worth Murtha's time, what is? Apparently, attacking making personal attacks against people who disagree with his policy views.
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Quote:
the G-man said:
Quote:
Matter-eater Man said:
Rove's fat ass really doesn't have much to do with Iraq beyond his spinning the war for the GOP. Rove just wasn't worth much of Murtha's time.
This is a telling point. It tends to demonstrate the current mindset of the democratic leadership, to wit, that they don't really want to engage in dialogue.
If debating the war isn't worth Murtha's time, what is? Apparently, attacking making personal attacks against people who disagree with his policy views.
You obviously didn't watch the Murtha interview. Most of it is Murtha talking about Iraq. He just spent a couple of seconds responding to Rove's personal attack in a fairly lengthy interview.
Fair play!
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The MEM dictionary:
Stating someone's policy proposal is ill-advised: a personal attack.
Making crude references to someone's personal appearance: a measured response.
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Quote:
wannabuyamonkey said:
Quote:
magicjay38 said:
Hillar squeezed out a puppy, she's entitled to have a fat ass! Rove's done nothing but pinch loafs his entire miserable life! ...
So, what's your excuse?
I have a sweet ass, WBAM. All the boys say so! 
"Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives." John Stuart Mill
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He who dies with the most toys is nonetheless dead.
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All the boys? You know, there's a Constitutional amendment that says you don't have to incriminate yourself.
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The New York Times reports that Senate Democrats are criticizing Kerry behind his back: Mr. Kerry has found his resolve. But it has not made his fellow Democrats any happier. They fear the latest evolution of Mr. Kerry's views on Iraq may now complicate their hopes of taking back a majority in Congress in 2006. . . .
Senate Democrats have been loath to express their opinions publicly, determined to emphasize a united front. But interviews suggest a frustration with Mr. Kerry, never popular among the caucus, and still unpopular among many Democrats for failing to defeat a president they considered vulnerable. Privately, some of his Democratic peers complain that he is too focused on the next presidential campaign. If Republicans were leveling criticisms like this, they'd be accused of " swift-boating" Kerry.
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Quote:
the G-man said:...
If Republicans were leveling criticisms like this, they'd be accused of "swift-boating" Kerry.
No, the events you just posted actually happened. "Swift Boating" as you know, is less reallity based.
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So while we may be at odds as to the veracity of the claims made by teh Swift Boat folks, at least we're all in one accord that the Democrats are divided. Hell even MEM is divided. He's trying to support teh Kerry plan, the Murtha plan and the Sen. Clinton plan in different threads and still try to claim unity of purpouse.
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Not sure what exactly your referring to WBAM? I've been correcting points of misinformation mostly. The only big thing the three vary on is a date for withdrawal. You on the other hand are united as a party supporting....Rumsfeld.
Fair play!
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 43,951 Likes: 6
Officially "too old for this shit" 15000+ posts
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OP
Officially "too old for this shit" 15000+ posts
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 43,951 Likes: 6 |
You cant have it both ways, MEM.
If truth is a defense to a charge of "swift boating," then you are admitting the Democrats who are critical of Kerry are correct and Kerry is advocating "cut and run."
On the other hand, if Kerry is being "swift boated" by his fellow Dems that means that many of his fellow democrats including, presumably Hillary Clinton, are liars.
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,251
6000+ posts
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6000+ posts
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,251 |
Putting the "fun" back in Fundamentalist Christian Dogma.
" I know God exists because WBAM told me so. " - theory9
JLA brand RACK points = 514k
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 15,799 Likes: 40
Fair Play! 15000+ posts
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Fair Play! 15000+ posts
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 15,799 Likes: 40 |
Usually when G-man says "You can't have it both ways" it's followed by a bit of rephrasing of an argument where upon G-man presents a false choice.
Unlike "Swift Boating" neither Kerry nor any of the Dems are disputing something Kerry did or said. Nobody is disputing the facts.
Fair play!
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,251
6000+ posts
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6000+ posts
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,251 |
You're having alot of trouble following what's going on, aint ya?
Putting the "fun" back in Fundamentalist Christian Dogma.
" I know God exists because WBAM told me so. " - theory9
JLA brand RACK points = 514k
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,251
6000+ posts
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6000+ posts
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,251 |
Quote:
Not sure what exactly your referring to WBAM? I've been correcting points of misinformation mostly. The only big thing the three vary on is a date for withdrawal. You on the other hand are united as a party supporting....Rumsfeld.
As far as teh only difference being the "date of withdrawl " between Clinton the rest, you could say the same about Bush, since he wants to withdraw teh troops eventually. The fact is as far as withdrawl, Clinton is on teh same page as Bush, you just seem to be willing to accept it coming from her, but not him, but being a Democrat puppet, I guess that can be accepted.
So now, come back with something like. "Oh, yea, well, you're partisan!" or "Well according to Media Matters Democrats aren;t partisan, Republicans are!"
Putting the "fun" back in Fundamentalist Christian Dogma.
" I know God exists because WBAM told me so. " - theory9
JLA brand RACK points = 514k
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