RKMBs Forums .::Important::. Politics and Current Events Bush threatens to veto anti-torture bill

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First Amongst Daves said:
Ah, my favourite homophobic bigot is still about.

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First Amongst Daves said:

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Wonder Boy said:
How disappointing that you resort to pretentious displays of pseudo-moral outrage, rather than making a lucid point.


As a condescending liberal once said to me:
Go for the ball, not the man.

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Was that me?

Kind of sounds like me. And, of course, I fit the bill for being both condescending and liberal.

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First Amongst Daves said:

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Wonder Boy said:
Don't attack Sammitch with name calling and assumptions about his person or judgement. Instead make a factual counter-argument to disprove what he said (if you can).

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I plead guilty, your Honour.

But using the words "pretentious" and "pseudo-moral" renders you equally guilty of ad hominem attack. ("Pretentious" I generally accept, although in this context it makes no sense and I gather it was just you shooting without aiming : "pseudo-moral" probably means that I maintain a morality which is not yours.)

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Pseudo-moral means you posture with outrage imposing your intolerant liberal beliefs of morality.
While you spurn and reject true morality, as it is defined by Judao-Christians, Jews, Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, and various other cultures throughout all of human history.

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First Amongst Daves said:
I at least attacked Sammitch on the basis of being both narrow-minded (admittedly ad hominem) and using casuistry (that a passport would define the difference in someone's worth). Lucid, and to the point, I had thought. Never mind.

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All it really expresses is your arbitrary condescension for his opinion. Even though his opinion represents the law of the land: That U.S. rights apply only to U.S. citizens, and that the other 5.7 Billion or so people in the world do not have the right to illegally immigrate to the U.S. and expect the same rights, only the right to be deported if they violate U.S. borders.

The U.S. has the right to defend its borders, and to only permit legal immigration, that is within levels that do not destabilize the country.

Those among the 5.7 billion who wish to immigrate to the U.S. can apply for legal immigration to the U.S., and move through the proper channels. That is their right.

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First Amongst Daves said:
Trust that is explanation enough for you to follow it. No doubt you were too busy straining at the leash to fully consider the substance of what I wrote.

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Whatever. Your hysteria-driven charicatures at every turn do not undermine the logic of what I've said.

You argue that those without rights in the U.S. should automatically be given rights, despite the fact that they came here illegally.
You argue that murderous terrorists, captured in a war on terror, who represent no nation, should be given the same rights as those in a conflict between nations, in a twisting of the Geneva Convention.
You argue for their processing and release before that war is concluded. So they can go back to wage further casualties on soldiers and civilians of the United States and other nations.

Gee, what you're saying makes perfect sense to me...


It is a classic example of how liberalism argues a perverted sense of idealism, that completely bypasses reality.

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First Amongst Daves said:
If you care to rebut me, be my guest. Try to do it in 200 words or less. You are very long-winded and tend to repeat yourself.

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I repeat no more than you.
( "Bigot, bigot bigot..." )
( "Homophobe, homophobe, homophobe..." )

And at least when I repeat myself, it is because of a solicited response, in correction of the hysteria-driven innacuracies of yourself and others on the Left.

And my response is exactly as long as it takes to counter the flawed assertions you raise.